Hello and Welcome to a slightly belated new edition of your favorite Round Table at SpoilerTV! SpoilerTV members featured in this issue are Marko (MK), Milo (MJ), Ellys (EC), Laura (LS), Claire (CS), Lisa (LM), Donna (DC), Yon (SJ) & Jamie (JC). You just have to sit back enjoy the read and join the discussion in the comment section down below.
1. 2+ Weeks of TCA behind us. What was your highlight? Was there a highlight for you? And does the TCA work in its current format? It is just for show or does actual scoop/info get revealed nowadays?
MK: Certainly the Crazy Ex-Girlfriend panel. It felt so honest and a very well deserved start of the shows goodbye tour. The cast and creators were so open and handled all the issues addressed so well. CEG was certainly a revelation over these last 3 years, excited to see what they will
That being said, there was an emptiness to this year's proceedings, a lack of insight and energy that I haven't seen being talked about in previous sessions. Even those with something to really showcase for the press didn't do it. Off the top of my head, I can't think of anything significant that was announced, although FOX's new Masked Singers competition show is still giving me nightmares. It was also disappointing how little Netflix presented. They have several hundred shows, and they couldn't use the time to promote a few more of them. Boring, people. Boring.
LS: The B99 panel is obviously my highlight! NBC is finally giving this show the love and respect it deserves and boy, oh boy, does it deserve it. All the news that came out of this panel makes me so incredibly excited. Another episode like "The Box"? Sign me the f*ck up! More on Rosa's story and maybe more Gina Rodriguez? Hell yeah! A possible #MeToo episode in the works? If any show can pull it off with the reverence it requires, it's this one. I am so unbelievably proud to call myself a fan of this show because it is far and away the show of our time and a show we could all use.
The IASIP panel was also amazing though! I am really excited for Season 13 (yes, 13!) of this great show. I always get a bit nervous, because with Sunny, I never what jokes are going to connect with me and the jokes I will run away from, screaming. But the news they've put out there makes it sound like it could be one amazing season.
LM: TCAs definitely aren't what they used to be - and having them follow SDCC is really pretty useless. But maybe that's just my genre-based bias... LOL.
SJ: Can my highlight be managing to sleep off my comic-con hangover and have the TCA's basically pass me by because that's exactly what happened. Having the TCA so soon after comic-con was not a good idea. Comic-con had all the trailers & the funny cast stuff. TCA had a bit of BTS's info and minute things about upcoming seasons but that's it. They were also extremely messy with information being delayed slightly and leaking out before panels which ruined a few surprises. But honestly the only thing I took away from the TCA was some minor Runaways s2 info, and even that didn't completely fill me with joy.
2. Another TCA another messy CBS day. While the Network tried to push and tell their narrative, a general displeasure was once again shown by their interpretation of diversity. CBS` attempt to portray diversity on screen was followed by the lack of diverse writers bts. Can we ever expect true representation from CBS or will they just continuously "try to be better" as they say?
MJ: CBS continues to be the worst network. Diversity is a glaring weak point for them and it's a real shame. As much as it is important to have diverse characters in front of the camera it is equally important to have a diverse creative team behind as it's no good having a good cast if the writing team aren't up to their level.
EC: With CBS what we're talking about is not just a lack of representation but also a dearth of creative storytelling. That's the reason that avid TV connoisseurs and critics really steer away from the network. It's not really a matter of playing it "safe" either. It's just most of their shows are rather lazy. They serve the same dish for dinner every night of the week. This could be because this is just what they do, what works for them, but it hasn't resulted in strong viewer numbers on most of their newer shows. Clearly, they just don't draw the kinds of talent that have given other networks addictive hits. The cast and crew don't seem to have the passion that you see on other shows. There's a very low social media presence for most CBS shows too. Clearly, they need a makeover. It's just unlikely they will ever put in the effort.
However, CBS did have a handful of wonderfully entertaining shows this past season: Mom, Young Sheldon, Hawaii Five-0, and perhaps MacGyver too, from what I saw of it. Other shows on the network are capable of enthralling one-off episodes.
Going back to representation, CBS has cast non-white people in their shows...yes, they have. But only a handful have gotten to play characters with interesting stories to tell in the long term.
LS: I don't understand why we haven't buried CBS in the ground yet. We've been having this talk about how trash they are for years, and I guess finally, now that the captain of that ship has gone way overboard, people who aren't submerged in the world of TV 24/7 can see what we've been trying to say. This is the least surprising thing that happened at any TCA panel, ever. I wish people would stop acting so surprised when people on this network fuck up. It's far more surprising when they don't.
SJ: CBS being messy? Must be a day that ends in y! Considering this is the network which judging from The Neighbourhood panel is going to infect households with reverse racism? Their version of trying to be better is not the same as the rest of us mere mortals. It was quite astonishing to me that the Magnum P.I showrunner could get information on diversity so badly wrong, but this type of floppage is expected with them. They're a network who know exactly who they're catering to, exactly which demographic is watching their shows and any attempts at diversity will always be seen for the shallow effort that they are.
3. A Bat-bomb was released upon us with the reveal that Ruby Rose would take the mantle of Batwoman in the upcoming Arrowverse crossover. What do you think about the casting? About the negative uproar? And could ALL fans really be pleased with a different casting?
MK: I am not her biggest fan but I usually don`t judge anyone before I see them play the character on screen. I would`ve preferred an actor who isn`t carrying that much baggage with her. That said, with the state of the internet nowadays, you can`t find an actor who will check every group's checklist. The more important thing for me is that her sexuality and characters.
EC: I have hardly read any comics. (Glad I got that off my chest!). So each bit of casting news for the Arrowverse or any other comic-based shows I usually seize upon as just a shiny nugget and look forward to meeting this new character. I have no pre-conceived notions of the character. But oddly enough whenever someone recognizable is cast it's hard to see past the familiar face to the character. I think that casting Ruby Rose was playing it too safe and that they should have put more effort into finding someone new. Correct me if I'm wrong but haven't most of the CW's shows been led by someone with little to no profile in the beginning?
LS: I said this last week, but she's not Jewish, so I don't want this. Intersectionality goes far beyond orientation, religious faith plays a role and in order to nail the authenticity, something that the CW claimed to care about, you need to hire the right person who can give the role the proper feel and respect it really deserves. I'm tired of the "it's so hard to find people who are X and X to play X role" because that holds no fcking weight. It's a truly ridiculous statement! Think about it. We all live in a fcking melting pot, you can find a f*cking Jewish lesbian in Hollywoo(d)! Moreover -- that shouldn't be your go-to excuse. "We didn't look hard enough so we settled." You're shitty. That's a shitty thing to do. Your representation and diversity are not intersectional, in that case, and you don't care enough about Judaism to look beyond one of the only lesbians working today that straight people are okay with.
LM: No casting will please all fans. Ruby Rose was a complete unknown to me (shoot me. I've been busy!), but in this day and age, I was happy to welcome a black, lesbian Batwoman. But then, I'm not invested in the character - I'm more interested in diversity. The uproar surrounding the casting is more troubling. It points to a real wave of fan entitlement that is going to make writers' jobs ever more difficult. And attacking the actors? Before you've even seen an episode? Ridiculous. I'm all for substantive criticism, but wait until you've seen the show. Having said that, I'm not all that confident in the CW to pull off a great show. I've only stuck with Arrow because I started with it from day one...
SJ: Hahahahahahahahaha. What can I say about this that hasn't already been said?! Without a doubt, she is not someone that I would've picked for this role. Not even close. Everything that I've ever heard about her, from getting involved in celebrity face-offs to outing people, leaves A LOT to be desired and acting wise? I think a cardboard cutout has more charisma. Congrats on The CW for casting a semi-name actress, it's just too bad she's not Jewish and I think that's the sticking point which more people should be focusing on. They said in the casting call that they wanted a Jewish lesbian. Sure, it's somewhat rare to have an LGBT person be a lead in a show, but you know what's ever rarer? A Jewish person. Even if you couldn't find a Jewish actress who is gay, they still could've found a Jewish actress, and that would've held more weight. We're still living in a society where diversity is a massive issue. People want to switch on their TV's and see someone on that represents them, that they can look up to. With Black Lightning, we have black superheroes, including one who is gay. Bringing Batwoman to the small screen and with this casting, they had a chance to make a difference, but instead went for the name and all the hype that would come with it, which I'll also point out has been extremely questionable. So many outlets have rushed to do the click bait articles on how Ruby Rose is going to be portraying the first out gay comic character. Nyssa Al Ghul, Alex Danvers, Sara Lance, Leo Snart and the aforementioned Anissa Pierce all say hi.
JC: Ruby Rose has yet to impress me where acting is concerned. Who knows, maybe she'll surprise me but I can't say I'm that excited about this casting news. It really does feel like they just googled "lesbian actress" and went with the first name that comes up. I would've preferred a lesser-known actress, I have a feeling they cast a known name on purpose.
4. Marvel is still pushing for James Gunn. While Roseanne got kicked off her power position ASAP without looking back, Disney (under Marvel`s push) is considering to rehire JG as GotG vol 3 director. Your take on the situation? When "Sins of the Past" are about to be redeemed what is the most important part: money, gender or race?
MK: I find it utterly disgusting. Is this really the world we are living in. I have no words. I expected more from everyone involved. Disney should really be careful with this one, cause they have a big image and redeeming Pedophiles really shouldn´t be on their to-do list, especially after the way the Roseanne issue was handled.
LS: Ugh, I'm already so frustrated from that question that this one makes me want to punch my wall. Photos were just released of him at a pedophilia-themed party. You can take back your, "Oh, it's just some thoughts he said on social media, he's grown as a person and actions speak louder than words" bullshit because that never mattered here anyway. He was a grown f_cking man when he spouted his nonsensical "jokes", and he's a grown fcking man at this predatory party, embracing who he really is. I wish the people defending him would "grow up" and "change" and realize that celebrities are just as terrible as us and they should be held just as accountable as any of us for the awful things they do. [sigh]
CS: Yes, I have a real issue with this situation. I was a big fan of both Roseanne and James Gunn’s GOTG franchise. But, you simply can not have different rules for people based on their politics, sex, race or religion. Roseanne was justly fired as was James Gunn IMHO. Why ABC ever gave her a chance is beyond me. But the industry seems so willing to forgive Gunn’s misdoings that I am left baffled. I went back and read a lot of his tweets and they are bad. The level of support for Gunn is through the roof? If he weren’t a white, male liberal would so many in Hollywood be coming out to support him? I highly doubt it.
LM: There is NO comparison between James Gunn and Roseanne. Gunn SHOULD be reinstated for Guardians. His tweets were 7 years old and had been deleted some time ago. They were taken out of context - though the context didn't make them a lot better - the main point is that he himself had realized that they were in bad taste and had taken them down. HE wasn't targeting a specific person with racist remarks. His entire cast signed a letter asking the producers to bring him back. At what point do we allow people to grow and move on? The entire Gunn episode has been a targeted attack. Gunn's tweets weren't indicative of a current and persistent abhorrent viewpoint. Roseanne's were just more of her hateful rhetoric - for which most of her cast immediately condemned her. Yes. People are responsible for their actions, but at some point, a few bad taste jokes need to be left in the past. Let's judge Gunn on what he's done lately. And that is nothing that should get his career destroyed.
DC: I have followed the James Gunn story I know the fans and his own cast want him back and from what have read it was old comments, granted in extremely poor taste and really a grown man should know better. The fact this type of banter was in the past brushed under the carpet as bad taste jokes, now it show's we won't tolerate that sort of mindless stupidity and insensitive comments anymore. If the latest news is proven he has been involved in certain pedophile themed party .. for a start I can't believe there is such a thing !! then he should be removed from the franchise but I believe a studio like Disney would not risk its reputation if proof is found.
Roseanne for years has gotten away with nasty vile vitriol to the point I know for a fact a certain celeb or two wanted to slap her. She is thought she was untouchable and the studio put her in her place.
Before the usual send off I wanna give a major round of applause to Laura Markus. Girl thanks for your contributions, your bada*s attitude, believes and heart you`ve shared in the WRTs, comment section, reviews and online. You will be missed. . .
That is a wrap guys! Ur turn now, come and join the discussion down below. Till next week. . .
