DEADLINE: A schedule that will see the TV version of Lethal Weapon as Empire’s lead-in in September.
CHAIKEN: Yes, I’m excited about it. It felt right, and just like a great fit for Empire. It feels to me like it’s going to be additive, like these two shows on one night of television could be a powerful night of television.
DEADLINE: Will finally seeing Shyne Johnson, played by Xzibit, in the finale mean that character is going be a big part of Season 3?
CHAIKEN: Well, Shyne Johnson is a character who was spoken of in the pilot and mentioned once or twice in Season 1 before, and we met him in the last episode of Season 2. Shyne is going to be a big character in our third season, as is Lucious’ half-brother Tariq who happens to be a fed with a very, very personal agenda to finally be the one to make this case against Lucious Lyon and Empire.
DEADLINE: With Season 2 having had an 18-episode run across the whole season as opposed to Season 1’s 12 episodes in early 2015, what lessons of that are you bringing to Season 3?
CHAIKEN: I think you saw it a bit in the latter half of Season 2 and you’ll see in Season 3 more than ever, is that we’re going to slow burn our stories a little bit more. The show is Empire. It will always have those big Empire moments, but every moment, every story that we’re telling, is driven by character.
CHAIKEN: Yes, I’m excited about it. It felt right, and just like a great fit for Empire. It feels to me like it’s going to be additive, like these two shows on one night of television could be a powerful night of television.
DEADLINE: Will finally seeing Shyne Johnson, played by Xzibit, in the finale mean that character is going be a big part of Season 3?
CHAIKEN: Well, Shyne Johnson is a character who was spoken of in the pilot and mentioned once or twice in Season 1 before, and we met him in the last episode of Season 2. Shyne is going to be a big character in our third season, as is Lucious’ half-brother Tariq who happens to be a fed with a very, very personal agenda to finally be the one to make this case against Lucious Lyon and Empire.
DEADLINE: With Season 2 having had an 18-episode run across the whole season as opposed to Season 1’s 12 episodes in early 2015, what lessons of that are you bringing to Season 3?
CHAIKEN: I think you saw it a bit in the latter half of Season 2 and you’ll see in Season 3 more than ever, is that we’re going to slow burn our stories a little bit more. The show is Empire. It will always have those big Empire moments, but every moment, every story that we’re telling, is driven by character.
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What can you say about the Cookie of it all and the impact this has on her going into next season?
She's clearly devastated and the most important thing I'll say is that you heard Cookie. She turned to her sons and she said, "I love you and I'll always do my best for my family, but your father and I are through." She's been hurt by Lucious time and time again and every time it seems as if they're really going to go there, they're really going to make this commitment, something happens and he lets her down. She's make the ultimate sacrifice for him but he clearly can't make the same sacrifice for her so we hope that everybody's eager to see what Cookie looks like when she really moves forward and says, "I have to start over for Lucious." She's not leaving the family; she's not leaving the company. She and Lucious will always be in one another's lives and in one another's faces, but Cookie made a vow. And Cookie is a woman of her word so let's see what that vow looks like and what that turns out for her.
What can you say about Hakeem going forward after getting left at the altar and with a baby on the way?
Poor Hakeem. He worked so hard and in the end he suffered multiple humiliations. I think that Hakeem is going to come back fighting for respect, probably fighting for dignity and respect through hip-hop. That's his world, that's the only place he's ever gotten any love and he's lost a lot. He's going to come back strong but he might come back strong but he might come back to some of his old ways because it didn't work out for him so well trying to really take the high road.
She's clearly devastated and the most important thing I'll say is that you heard Cookie. She turned to her sons and she said, "I love you and I'll always do my best for my family, but your father and I are through." She's been hurt by Lucious time and time again and every time it seems as if they're really going to go there, they're really going to make this commitment, something happens and he lets her down. She's make the ultimate sacrifice for him but he clearly can't make the same sacrifice for her so we hope that everybody's eager to see what Cookie looks like when she really moves forward and says, "I have to start over for Lucious." She's not leaving the family; she's not leaving the company. She and Lucious will always be in one another's lives and in one another's faces, but Cookie made a vow. And Cookie is a woman of her word so let's see what that vow looks like and what that turns out for her.
What can you say about Hakeem going forward after getting left at the altar and with a baby on the way?
Poor Hakeem. He worked so hard and in the end he suffered multiple humiliations. I think that Hakeem is going to come back fighting for respect, probably fighting for dignity and respect through hip-hop. That's his world, that's the only place he's ever gotten any love and he's lost a lot. He's going to come back strong but he might come back strong but he might come back to some of his old ways because it didn't work out for him so well trying to really take the high road.
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What kind of themes will be explored in season 3?
Luscious, who is the ultimate narcissist and controller of everyone else’s fate, is very thrown and shaken by the revelation of his half-brother, and especially by the gauntlet that Tariq throws down. “Our father was a good cop but a bad man. It looks like each of us got half of him.” That’s going to really stick in Lucious’ craw and be a big part of his drive going forward. Thematically, season 3 is all about the battle for dark versus light, the battle for the soul of Empire, in which Lucious is trying to claim everyone’s soul and the forces of good largely represented by Jamal slouching towards the light with his conviction to end the cycle are opposing luscious. That’s our season 3.
Luscious, who is the ultimate narcissist and controller of everyone else’s fate, is very thrown and shaken by the revelation of his half-brother, and especially by the gauntlet that Tariq throws down. “Our father was a good cop but a bad man. It looks like each of us got half of him.” That’s going to really stick in Lucious’ craw and be a big part of his drive going forward. Thematically, season 3 is all about the battle for dark versus light, the battle for the soul of Empire, in which Lucious is trying to claim everyone’s soul and the forces of good largely represented by Jamal slouching towards the light with his conviction to end the cycle are opposing luscious. That’s our season 3.
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Will Lucious’ mom be back for Season 3, and will people find out she’s Lucious’ mother?
You can expect Leah to be a big problem for Lucious in every way in Season 3 with all of those entanglements and her animus towards him obviously driving a lot of her unpredictable behavior.
Last week, Jamal was shot. Will that continue to impact him in the new season, or will he be fully recovered when the show is back?
Jamal’s recovery is just beginning. Jamal was shot. He suffered a devastating physical injury and an emotional injury that we’ve only just begun to see the effects of. You saw that he came out of the hospital in a very fragile state, vowing that he wants to end this cycle, and I would say that at the end of the episode, that determination is crystallized after everything that’s happened.
Have you mapped out Season 3?
Let’s say that we definitely are going to answer the question of who dies at the top of the season, and we’re going to set our stories in motion in a very dramatic way. In the finale, we set the table for a challenge to Empire and the Lyon family that’s going to serve as the framework for the whole of Season 3, with a “Godfather” style opus of crime and hip hop that has Lucious as the beleaguered kingpin battling back this federal investigation led by a man with a personal grievance, and thug rappers who helped him to build his Empire and are now coming back for their pound of flesh.
You can expect Leah to be a big problem for Lucious in every way in Season 3 with all of those entanglements and her animus towards him obviously driving a lot of her unpredictable behavior.
Last week, Jamal was shot. Will that continue to impact him in the new season, or will he be fully recovered when the show is back?
Jamal’s recovery is just beginning. Jamal was shot. He suffered a devastating physical injury and an emotional injury that we’ve only just begun to see the effects of. You saw that he came out of the hospital in a very fragile state, vowing that he wants to end this cycle, and I would say that at the end of the episode, that determination is crystallized after everything that’s happened.
Have you mapped out Season 3?
Let’s say that we definitely are going to answer the question of who dies at the top of the season, and we’re going to set our stories in motion in a very dramatic way. In the finale, we set the table for a challenge to Empire and the Lyon family that’s going to serve as the framework for the whole of Season 3, with a “Godfather” style opus of crime and hip hop that has Lucious as the beleaguered kingpin battling back this federal investigation led by a man with a personal grievance, and thug rappers who helped him to build his Empire and are now coming back for their pound of flesh.
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TVLINE | Let’s dive right into that cliffhanger of Anika and Rhonda’s brutal fight on the balcony. Was it always supposed to come down to that moment? And did you feel like the most surprising twist might be to have Rhonda’s stairway assailant turn out to be the primary suspect – rather than some last-minute twist?
We always knew that it was Anika who pushed Rhonda. And we were aware how many viewers were dead certain that it was Anika who pushed Rhonda. But we did talk about whether it could be somebody else. There are certainly other characters in Empire who could have been culprits, given all the agendas and motives, and we could’ve done that just for the sake of defying audience expectations. [Laughs] But in the end, we wanted to tell the story we believed in and that we thought was the most earned, the most real and the most justifiable. And frankly, when you get deep into defying audience expectations, you can get all twisted up, sometimes to the point where it would have been less surprising if it were somebody other than Anika — as you suggested.
TVLINE | I actually howled when Anika spat out, “You’re damn right I did it, you bitch!”
It was loads of fun to create the scene — and I have to give Lee Daniels a lot of the credit for it. We went back and forth over where exactly the show, this season, and that particular storyline should end. Lee, with his love of heightened drama and classic soaps, really, really wanted to go there [to the fight sequence], and in the end, I’m glad we did. There’s some great scripted dialogue on our show, but that scene itself was very sparely written. It’s quite possible the only scripted line in it was Andre’s “No!” Rhonda and Anika just went at it!
TVLINE | Is one or both of them going to die?
I certainly know the answer to that question, but for the purposes of our conversation, what I’ll say is it sure as hell looks that way. All we have to go on right now is the sound of that scream and the look on Andre’s face — and that, to me, says somebody went over that railing. And it would be ludicrous to say that would be a survivable fall! [Laughs] We talked about how high up they are – and we agreed it was somewhere around 30 stories. Assuming one of those ladies went over, she’s in for it.
We always knew that it was Anika who pushed Rhonda. And we were aware how many viewers were dead certain that it was Anika who pushed Rhonda. But we did talk about whether it could be somebody else. There are certainly other characters in Empire who could have been culprits, given all the agendas and motives, and we could’ve done that just for the sake of defying audience expectations. [Laughs] But in the end, we wanted to tell the story we believed in and that we thought was the most earned, the most real and the most justifiable. And frankly, when you get deep into defying audience expectations, you can get all twisted up, sometimes to the point where it would have been less surprising if it were somebody other than Anika — as you suggested.
TVLINE | I actually howled when Anika spat out, “You’re damn right I did it, you bitch!”
It was loads of fun to create the scene — and I have to give Lee Daniels a lot of the credit for it. We went back and forth over where exactly the show, this season, and that particular storyline should end. Lee, with his love of heightened drama and classic soaps, really, really wanted to go there [to the fight sequence], and in the end, I’m glad we did. There’s some great scripted dialogue on our show, but that scene itself was very sparely written. It’s quite possible the only scripted line in it was Andre’s “No!” Rhonda and Anika just went at it!
TVLINE | Is one or both of them going to die?
I certainly know the answer to that question, but for the purposes of our conversation, what I’ll say is it sure as hell looks that way. All we have to go on right now is the sound of that scream and the look on Andre’s face — and that, to me, says somebody went over that railing. And it would be ludicrous to say that would be a survivable fall! [Laughs] We talked about how high up they are – and we agreed it was somewhere around 30 stories. Assuming one of those ladies went over, she’s in for it.
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