The Blacklist - T. Earl King VI (No. 94) - Review: "Survival Of The Fittest"
Mar 9, 2015
GN Reviews The BlacklistFor the second week in a row, ratings for The Blacklist have increased very well. Not that anyone was worried about the state The Blacklist has been in, but it's always good news to know the program you enjoy and follow has a viewership increase on a weekly basis. When you combine DVR viewing on a 3 and 7 day time period after the episode airs, The Blacklist ends up doing extremely well in the ratings department.
Last week's episode introduced an interesting blacklister with the name of T. Earl King VI, played by Jeffrey DeMunn (Mob City; The Walking Dead) and his two sons, Tyler and Francis. The King family supplement their family fortune with profits from illegal auctions for which they conduct. The items up for sale, however, were not your usual items up for bid. Included was anything from pilfered paintings worth millions to contraband and even people. This, of course, is where Red comes into play as he becomes one of the prime lots in the auction up for grabs. As Red is groomed for the crying of his lot at auction, he receivrs visits from different members of the King family. In true Red fashion, he mocks each one, playing off their belief of 'family'. Red ponders out loud to Tyler King at one point how they have managed to retain their Dynasty and their wealthy stature through so many years. Throughout the episode we see the infamous King Family, and how they truly don't care for each other, mirroring Red's relationship with Liz and what the words 'care' and 'family' represent in their lives.
Some familiar faces emerged in the episode as well. Madeline Pratt was the catalyst of the main event. We all remember Madeline Pratt from season one, episode fourteen; Red tricked her into giving up precious information regarding the location of an important item by playing on her emotions. Now, she desires payback for what he did to her by helping the Kings capture him for the auction. One can't help but wonder if and when we will see Madeline again. I am certain Red will want retribution for what she did, however, I can't imagine she will receive another episode all to herself. Needless to say, Red is going to be very angry when he crosses paths with her the third time.
From the promos released earlier in the week we knew Tom would once again surface in last Thursday's episode. I had the idea his return would have more of an impact on the main characters. I was curious as to why Liz would answer the phone from the man who ruined her life, however, it did turn out to be helpful when Liz took his advice and sneezed to cease the potential wave of questions from Tyler King. Now in Germany, Tom is certainly far away from Liz. I wonder how he will return back into the fold. He appeared eager when speaking with his handler about receiving a new undercover assignment. I imagine the German man that bought him a beer at the end of the episode will most likely be a blacklister in the near future.
The famous scene where Red was about to be shot by General Yaabari where Red whispers Lizzie's name became most discussed and created a polarizing debate. Some fans believed he knew Liz was there while some fans, myself included, chose to believe Red had 'Lizzie' as his final thought and 'famous last words' before he would have been killed, not knowing she was there. I truly believe Red's final word and thought was going to be none other than Liz. My reasoning is this - Why would he say her name if he knew she was there and destroy the element of surprise that would ultimately save his life? - How could he have possibly known she was there when he was facing the opposite way? - And lastly, why did he appear surprised when Liz shot Yaabari as he turned to see who it was? This is also why I included the photo above. It shows Red the moment after Liz shoots Yaabari dead to save him. Red appears in shock because he didn't know Liz was standing there. I would love to know what everyone's opinion is about this particular scene - please comment below.
Last Thursday's episode was one of my favorites this season. My most liked scene was watching Liz and Red's conversation in the back of the FBI vehicle. Liz obviously has strong feelings of camaraderie for Red and you can clearly see his feelings for Liz lean towards the paternal side (I am not saying he is her father, I am just conveying his feelings were 'fatherly'). Liz and Red work great as a team and, whatever their true relationship is, make The Blacklist much more enjoyable to watch. When one of them is in a dire situation (which usually is Liz) the other always comes to the rescue. When we see how Tyler and Francis King compete and are fine with the other dying in front of the other, Red and Liz want nothing more than to go the extra mile, risking their life to save each other. We have seen this many times with Red going into extremely dangerous situations just to save Liz and now, this past episode in particular, Liz goes to potentially deadly lengths just to save Red. Together, they are greater than the sum of their parts. Combined, they are the embodiment of 'survival of the fittest'.
Red's Quotes
- "I've always found fear to be the most valuable sense"
Red to King
- "Careful there, boys! You don't want to bruise the merchandise"
Red to Francis King after Red gets captured
- "Your insistence on not speaking is making a tedious exercise ever so much worse"
Red while getting measured for a Tuxedo
- "I haven't even begun to try"
Red
- "Avoid the yard. Be nice to your cell mates. And by all means, don't eat the franks and beans."
Red to the King Family
Music from the Episode
- "Major Tom (Voellig Losgeloest)" - Peter Schilling
Tom prepares for his next assignment
- "String Quartet No. 13 IN B Flat Major, Op. 130 - IV. Alla Danza Tedesca (Allegro Assai)" by Ludwig van Beethoven
Liz mingles at the auction then stops to admire a Van Gogh painting; Red saves Liz when she can't answer a question about Princeton from Tyler
- "Spring (Among the Living)" by My Morning Jacket
The FBI raid the auction; Red tells Liz to never risk her life for him ever again.
Thoughts and Discussion
- Here are some of the items that were up for auction: "Three Dollar Bill - Bank of Cape Fear - 1853"; "Radioactive Material"; "Davidoff-Morini Stradivarius - which was reported stolen/missing in 1995" (red mentions this as an auction item from auctions past); "Van Gogh painting 'Sea at Scheveningen'"; "Drawing by Leonardo DaVinci"; "A Columbian girl";
- Did you notice...Red knows his Ming Dynasty vessel's. When he says the "Cat's Eye" chrysoberyl's are supposed to be brown, not green, he is right.
- In keeping with the Russian theme we have seen in regard to Liz's past, one of the people Red mentions that was up for auction was Raoul Wallenberg. He was a Swedish architect, businessman, diplomat and humanitarian, who was presumed dead in 1947 in Moscow. A memorial to him stands in the courtyard of the Russian Rudomino Library of Foreign Languages in Moscow. In Saint Petersburg, the Institute of Special Pedagogy and Psychology bears Wallenberg's name.
- We still do not know what happened to the man that was abducted from the apartment that Red was supposed to go meet, but instead went to take care of Liz's problem in 'The Deer Hunter' episode. He was the man that was on the other end of the line from the number Red retrieved from Fitch's safe.
- Did you notice...Tom's new name for his new identity in Germany is "Christof Mannheim". During the scenes when he was getting his tattoos (translated: Germany for Germans) the song playing for the montage was "Major Tom" by Peter Schilling. The song is about an astronaut (Major Tom) who leaves on a space mission and while in orbit has some trouble with the ship he is controlling. No one on Earth believes he will make it home, but he eventually does. I wonder when our Tom will make it home.
- Who is the man from Johannesburg General Yaabari referenced? He was supposed to take Red's head to him so this man obviously wants Red dead.
- Did you notice...When Tom is getting his tattoo's, flanking his back are two lions standing on their hind legs. If you take the silhouette of the lions it very much resembles the scar on Liz's wrist as well as the symbol etched into Tom's (and Gina's) spy box from Season One. I don't think that is a coincidence.
Thank you for checking out my review! Please comment below so we can discuss the episode and the series some more. Have a great week everyone!
Finally, a much better episode. Really good episode and one of season 2's best.
ReplyDeleteI agree. It was one of the better ones of the season. It's possibly one of my favorite of the series...It was a very good episode...
ReplyDeleteSo far, season 2 has been pretty good, but underwhelming.
ReplyDeleteHOTTest ep ever seen. Died over Lizzington feels hope she saves him again. Eager for more feels
ReplyDeleteA very fun episode over alll
ReplyDeleteRe: The Y Symbol:
- I will be a happy man when/if we finally learn what the "Y" symbol represents! XD
It is vague enough where almost anything can resemble it if looked at from just the right angle! From Liz's scar to the standing lions to the Berlin Dancing Bear ... The last may have made sense if Berlin was Red's true nemesis, but alas not so much.
Re: Red's Last Word:
- I feel the way you do in that Red was saying "Lizzie" as his last word. I do not think he knew she was there or was beginning some statement that begin with her name. She was the last thing on his mind so he said her name. That simple.
That said, I do not think that establishes Red is her father beyond a reasonable doubt. I think she is by far the most important person in Red's life right now, for the Fulcrum or whatever reason it may be. That is enough for Red's last thoughts to wander to her and it is enough to stop me from wondering about their genetic relationship..
Re: The South African Mystery Man:
- I'm not sure that the mystery South African man will be a player as the season goes forward. I think he most likely is just someone from Red's past that wants him dead. Maybe connected to the Mombasa Cartel, but maybe not.... I do not think the South African man is McCready, but he could be a member of the Alliance I guess... Maybe. *Shrug*
I am definitely in agreement with you about him saying Lizzie. He would have to be an idiot to risk her getting shot by announcing her prescence. We all know he isn't an idiot.
ReplyDeleteI think people are getting a little nuts trying to find other possible connections between Liz and Red on other boards. The latest theory that makes me lol is the idea that Red is Lizzy's mother and that he had a sex change operation. Seriously...
I still maintain that it it looks like a horse it probably is a horse. If his connection to Lizzy was simply the fulcrum, he would have taken that memory long ago. If he just warranted to clear his name or get rid of his enemies, he could have worked with any FBI agent. She isn't even a "great" FBI agent. He doesn't need her to catch the baddies on the blacklist.
Some people speculate that she is his niece, but since there is no mention a brother/uncle, I think that is just a way for him not to be the father. I need evidence of sone kind to believe that. Some speculate he killed her father, but if so, I don't see him ranking her above his supposed biological daughter and the only other candidate for the bubble girl, Jennifer.
She was to be his last word on Earth...
He is her father. (I hope!)
Completely with you - he had no idea she was behind them and only said her name as he thought he was going to die. Strong stuff. Something not matching up ( HA, this is The Blacklist, after all) is Red's seeming disinterest in the missing daughter who wants nothing to do with him. I guess it will all come into play once we get the true dynamic, familial or otherwise, with his past life. Call me sappy, but I hope he is her father because anything else, even her as a much younger baby sister, would not have the meaning of her being his first daughter. It does not matter what turns out to be the truth as there will still be disappointed fans from one side or the other, no pleasing everyone. Missing Mr. Kaplan, sigh.
ReplyDeleteSince I'm watching more and more higher quality TV, The Blacklist continues to fall down on my favorite TV shows.
ReplyDeleteI second that - the second part of S02 has been very rewarding - ever since 2x08 it has been uphill in baby steps, just wasn't a fan of the Deer Hunter [ooc], but that is just a preference of style of the weekly blacklister and characterisation. The overall myth arc has been the most interesting factor this time around.
ReplyDeleteObviously The Blacklist (like most other shows) are a lot better when they have an episode that has a serialized arc than a case of the week.
ReplyDeleteOK. I will admit I disagreed with Red saying Lizzie as his final out loud thought until I discussed it with someone who knows this program better than I know the back of my hand. I do agree it was certainly a much better episode than last week's as well. As far as the ¥ symbol is concerned, after reading this remarkable review, I plan on watching the episode again and discusding it further, I am sure I will definitely have the answer. Great catch on the Ming vase. I always enjoy your "Did You Notice" section and of course, your Red's anecdotes as well. You also make it easy for me if I like a particular song they used. Sorry to say Darque, but I disagree on your theory of The African Mystery Man. Geo's theory, to me, sounds much more logical. Of course we shall soon see who else wants Red's head in a mason jar, so to speak. I also have a feeling that Red is Liz's father. Eventually this will come to light albeit most likely not until the final episode. Geo Sir, I commend you on another incredible review. Absolutely one of the best on Spoiler TV. I'm sure everyone here will definitely agree. Until next time, Keep up the awesome work! Always look forward to reading your reviews. Never disappointed.
ReplyDeleteNow I must finish my dinner.....of franks and beans of course. 😋
Nice review! This was a great episode, one of the better ones of the last few weeks for me. Great classic Red one-liners with the "You don't want to bruise the merchandise" as you listed, and the "Aha, what are the odds!?" after shooting King was fantastic. Snarky Red is certainly my favourite Red.
ReplyDelete- I love shows that keep
continuity by referencing previous episodes.
- I also don't believe Red
knew Liz had come back for him; the way he said her name the second time
and his expression sounded/looked like pure surprise.
- I’m intrigued where the plot
will go with Tom. Right now everything is still very confusing, so I’m looking
forward to finding out more about his mission.
- The only thing that I didn't like about this episode was Liz and her hot and
cold attitude toward Red. One week it's her giving him an ultimatum that their
association is purely business, then in this she was tearing up while telling
him she came back because she cares for him. I understand that she's unsure
what their relationship is and whether she can trust him 100%, but I
wish the writers would stop flip-flopping her emotions so much.
There is actually a big part of the fandom that ships Red and Liz together!? Dear god.
ReplyDeleteOh yes, you have no idea - more and more are joining each day! :D we just can't ignore the UST that is for us at least, obvious to see. [James & Megan] have chemistry.
ReplyDeleteIt felt like this episode was played out of order from the rest of them ......
ReplyDeletecrazy!
ReplyDeleteHow can people in this day and age actually support incest...?
Soooo gross!
Ha ! XD
ReplyDeleteDon't feel bad. Difference in opinion are good things in a speculative show like this.
My thought process is to take the first thing that comes to mind and then go in a different direction... Johannesburg man becoming a player seems the most obvious choice, but Red has enemies all over the world from his past dealings.
Being a huge fan of wild life documentaries the next place my mind went to when hearing a South African town was poaching. Kruger National Park is arguably the most famous reserve in Africa and has its share of poaching issues. Some mentioned in Mombasa Cartel. If I had connections to poaching and Red was causing me business problems I would pay a large sum to have him killed.
Honestly though, mystery man being next season's big bad, a Blacklister to come later or nothing more than a nameless man in the background are not mutually exclusive options.
James Spader is so charismatic that he has chemistry with everyone and even some inanimate objects!
ReplyDeleteI bet there have been huge hat fights in the wardrobe department as they all vie to be the one he wears in the next episode! XD
Before I tell you your answers let me start by saying this writer loves fairy tale as last week was Snow white and this one appears to be sleeping beauty. It could have been Alice in Wonderland but that requires the mad hatter actually be beheaded.
ReplyDeleteNow your answers in order of how I see them:
1. Both answers are wrong. Francis told red that this was all over legacy. Red said money would be so banal. Francis pointed out that none of Red's people were there to save him. He was wrong. There Auction was filled with people who neither bid nor were there when the police showed up. Watch in the background their behavior. Red leaves the stage they leave the room, Back to Lizzie the one person in the world who would support Red absent money. Red is not shocked it is Lizzie but rather that he was right. After the Luther it was a question mark, but let's face it she does not listen to him as she does not know who he is to her, but she loves him still the same. Oh in case you have not read Sleeping Beauty, the first words Rose says to her prince are " Are you my prince?" As anyone prince would do but Red hoped it would and would not be her.
2. As for the tattoo of lions, could be a coat of arms like Edansk as it has two lions buttressing a shield, no telling but it never hurts to google Russian lion and see what comes up.
3. Not sure who Bud is but the man in the bar is a nazi supremacist. The name Christof could be the iceman of Arendelle. While Mannhiem is the city Gen Patton died, allegedly assassinated by the OSS. The complete name is a level 80 NPC from Wizards of Warcraft
4. The guy on the phone is most likely dead as I suspect Cooper's buddy to be in the syndicate and any thing that gets to him gets to the syndicate as well. He is their man in the US set to take down Red now.
5. Who said it was a man in South Africa? The bounty was very specific. Some one wants Red's head as though he could have something of value in it. What man might know that. Head hunting is more a woman's game. (Red Queen - Alice in Wonderland... who by the way is patterned after queen Elizabeth. Her sister Bloody Mary Queen of Scots ) What is Lizzie's adoptive name "Scott" and her birth name Masha (Maria) Kind of wondering how many Red herrings are out here and how many people want you to figure out noone is who they seem to be.
Enjoy
I think the daddy theory is the most interesting too. It may be "too obvious" but it gives Red a major Achilles heel and opens up a series of emotional questions/struggles for Liz. I think he has been trying to "win" her over so to speak and redeem himself. He is a "bad" guy. Had he just approached her from the get go, she would hVe been disgusted and rejected him as a father. I believe that is part of why he says nothing. Also, her knowing would put her at more risk from enemies of him and put her at more risk of oing crazy things to protect him like she did in this episode. Plus, I truly think he believes his former identity ( her father) is gone.
ReplyDeleteGood points,especially the last about his believing the man that he was is gone.
ReplyDeleteGreat review! I agree completely, Red didn't know that Lizzie was there, and I think that's what made her attitude towards him change (yet again xD); she heard him, understood she was his final thought, and realized he does care about her (or that's how I read it anyway).
ReplyDeleteAs for the man who wants Red dead, I'm not so sure it's relevant. There are probably tons of people in the world who want Red's head, both good and bad.
LOL and wow i like your analysis of Red almost being shot
ReplyDeleteImagine being wanted the world over? I'm sure the writers are scurrying to come up with plenty other blacklisters to satisfy our palette. I do still wonder what became of the little Italian boy. He reminds me of a young man I know who happens to be, just like him, a very astute individual. My favorite scene, as I mentioned in my comment above what Red and Liz's discussion in the closing scene which went somewhat like this.......
ReplyDeleteYou are so damaged. You can't accept help from anyone. Has anyone ever helped you? Is that why you are the way you are? Because you don't feel deserving of it? Is that why you can't be vulnerable for a second? I risked my life for you because I care about you. Deal with that. And when someone does something nice, you're supposed to say, "Thank you." Thank you. You're welcome. But never do it again.
I so agree with that statement. When you develop a very special connection with someone and you end up becoming very close to them, you'll want to protect them in every single way you know how. Sometimes though you may become overbearing which could actually damage the friendship, but no matter what, if there is a strong bond between the two of you, no matter if you argue and even say the dreaded word, goodbye, that is where the gift of your connection comes in to play and you manage to repair the damage, because just as both Liz and Red know, in your heart of hearts, there will always be people who come and go in your life, but only the very special ones remain. Those are the ones you truly care about so much you will, without any hesitation risk life and limb for them because you will never meet anyone like them in your lifetime ever again.
Your best review of Season 2B! I really enjoyed it. Specially this: 'Throughout the episode we see the infamous King Family, and how they truly don't care for each other, mirroring Red's relationship with Liz and what the words 'care' and 'family' represent in their lives.'
ReplyDeleteUsually the parallels can be spotted a mile away, but the ones in this episode were way more subtle, and you hit the nail right on the head! I loved the Blacklisters this week. They were creepy to the max, totally diabolical, and the best was that they had an actual legacy! I love that they took down a family that had been scheming for centuries, and I was so happy when Red shot him lol. Best line: what are the odds. Haha. You're right, that part where they storm the room together was totally kickass.
I definietly think he was saying Lizzie because she was his last thought. No doubt about it. And I'm actually enjoying the idea of these paternal feelings way more under the assumption that he's not her father, rather than vice versa!
The car scene is now one of my most favourite scenes. Brilliant acting, I loved the way they filmed it, with all the close ups. Spader was amazing, specially the way he was like you must never do that again. I'm hoping this incident puts an end to Liz's constant flipping between angry and not. I feel like that's what the writers were trying to do. Maybe the next episode will start with Liz in her new apartment lol.
I knew I had heard that song before! Never realised there was a German version for it. The music adds so much to this show, they're so clever about it. And Major Tom ha!
I'll have to go back to that tattoo, nice catch that it matches Liz's hand. Maybe Tom is trying to contact someone from that organisation, and that's why he has to go undercover. At this moment, the most logical conclusions appears to be that the scar is actually a symbol for some organisation.
Glad that ratings are going up, because the quality definitely is! Thanks!
The best review , I agree, for one of the best episode of the Blacklist. I enjoy to read it (whith the comments) every weeks from France. You make a very good summery of what I think and what I feel. Love Red's quote and the choice of the music in every story. I have nothing more to add. Thank you Geo N.
ReplyDeleteNo, Thank YOU Marie! That is very kind of you to say about my reviews. I very much appreciate the kind words.
ReplyDeleteIt was one of the best episodes of the season and, possibly, the series.
Incest? LOL please refer from saying things like that when nothing is proven yet. We support Love between these characters, who imo are not related. If Red was replaced by Ressler/Tom no one would think twice about calling it romantic love ;-) plus TPTB support it on social media.
ReplyDeleteThank you for the kind words!
ReplyDeleteI like picking up on the parallels in each episode, if there are any. And the car scene is going to be a very memorable scene going forward and I'm sure there will be call backs to it in future seasons when certain things get revealed.
That song, Major Tom, is actually a David Bowie title. There are many uses of that song in other media. I learned that form a very good friend of mine. There are similarities with Elton John's "Rocket Man' also.
I think the scar and 'Y' symbol are part of an organization also. I am looking forward to that reveal.
And you are very right, the quality is going up and so should the ratings. I am going to make a prediction and say the next few episodes are going to get better and better.
Thank you for the kind words! I really do appreciate that!
ReplyDeleteI love your take on that scene. I did not think about that; perhaps Liz heard him say that and that is what made her changer her mind about him?
I am not sure that the man from Johannesburg is relevant on a large scale, but I do think he will at the very least be a blacklister of the week.
Just to add one more thing geo, the tattoos on Tom's back are two lions with their tail between their legs, means coward. But also: The lion is a common charge in heraldry. It traditionally symbolises bravery, valour, strength, and royalty, because historically it has been regarded as the king of beasts
ReplyDeleteA "lion rampant" is depicted in profile standing erect with forepaws raised.[2]The position of the hind legs varies according to local custom: the lion may stand on both hind legs, braced wide apart, or on only one, with the other also raised to strike; the word rampant is often omitted, especially in early blazon, as this is the most usual position of a carnivorous quadruped.
Plus notice anything 'funny' about Christof's new passport?
Yes thank you, are you going to answer all the questions? i certainly have some issues with the continuity.
ReplyDeleteThank you for this...these are all good theories. Just to clarify, when you said this 'writer' above were you referring to me or The Blacklist writer?
ReplyDelete1. I wouldn't say my answers are wrong because there are future actions that have yet to be played out that could affect the way we view some of the elements in this past episode. I do think that part of it is about family/caring for others you value. I suppose 'legacy' as you describe is not far form that, but family and caring for other individual sans monetary compensation appeared, to me at least, to be a few of the lessons to be gained from the episode and some other Blacklist episodes as well.
2. It's possible that is a coat of arms. I don't think we have enough information about it just yet.
3. I think Bud is just Tom's handler.
4. The guy on the phone from two episodes ago could be dead, but I think we need more information at this point. That is an interesting theory about Tom Connolly belonging to the cabal that wants The Fulcrum and would love nothing more than to take down Red, but I think that is nothing more than a "C" story line that has nothing to do with Red, the cabal or The Fulcrum.
5. General Yaabari said it was man. His line was, "A man in Johannesburg, has put a forty million dollar bounty on your head". So it is a man, but your theory about the Red Queen is interesting.
Thank you, like last week, I enjoy reading your theories.
There was a few people who said the same thing to me. That is interesting.
ReplyDeleteThank you for the kind words!
ReplyDeleteI love Red's one-liners. So much so, that I added the "Red Quotes" section when the second season began.
I've always said that the balance between procedural and serialized story telling in The Blacklist is what make the show so unique and fun to watch each week.
I am very interested to see where Tom's story will go. I am glad we get a few episodes coming up that will reveal what he is up to and how that ties into the rest of the story.
I hope Liz's 'flip-flopping' emotions toward Red will slow down or stop entirely since this past episode.
Thank you for the amazing and kind words Joe! Your comment, as well as many of the others, are truly inspiring, so thank you very much!
ReplyDeleteI'm glad you enjoy my "Did you notice" section. I enjoy picking out small details in each episode and sharing them with everyone so it's nice to know that you enjoy reading them.
Whether or not Red is Liz's father we don't have enough information, but the writers definitely like to tease us with little comments here and there that could favor both ideas.
I hope you enjoyed your franks and beans, Lol!
I love reading your comments each week as well, so thank you for participating!
Thank you for the kind words! I can't believe all of the people that enjoy my reviews this much, it really means a lot to me, so thank you for that!
ReplyDeleteYour questions that need to be answered before whether or not Red is Liz's father are perfect. I usually add questions such as those at the end of my reviews, but this episode seemed to not require it as much. Last episode did and in the next review of mine for an episode that does require it I will include those questions. Very smart on your part, thank you.
And, of course, where is Hudson!?! Lol! Great question, poor dog. I'm not sure if you read one of my first reviews of Season 2, but the dog that played Tom and Liz's pet in season one passed away, sadly. So, if this new dog appears different the reason is they needed a new dog.
The man form Johannesburg could possibly be the new big bad for season three or just a blacklister of the week, who knows? Well...maybe the writers know, :)
And to be honest I do think Red should be upset with Madeline. Her efforts lead to him almost getting killed. I'm not saying he should get her killed, but I think he should at the very least be angry with her.
Thank you for the info on Tom. I look forward to those episodes because his story line now is appealing, especially to know how they plan to bring him back into the fold.
Thank you again for the great comment. sometimes I can't get to certain things in my Review because of length, but I'm glad that when people who read the review comment to shed some light on elements I just could not get to.
Yeah I could not believe that when I heard there are some fans that ship Lizzington, Lol.
ReplyDeleteI think they are under the assumption that Red and Liz are not related Bertha.
ReplyDeleteLol, this is a very funny comment! LOL
ReplyDeleteVery true, good points. Whatever the outcome of that paternal story line there will be disappointed and judgmental fans. You are right, they can;t please everyone.
ReplyDeleteLol, I miss Mr. Kaplan also.
Very good points Ashley! The story line of him being (or not being) her father also has some other questions that beg to be answered connected to it. For example, if he is NOT her father, then why did he give himself up to the FBI in S1E1? Was it only to get to The Fulcrum? I find that a little hard to believe. Red is a smart and resourceful man; he could have just kidnapped Liz and performed the Memory Extraction on her like Luther Braxton did. However, we do know that Red took care of Liz growing up so there is some sort of connection with he has with her. If not her dad then what? Also, Why help her at all and more importantly "Why Now?" why did he choose to give himself up to the FBI at THAT moment if only for The Fulcrum? He could have entered her life at ANY moment if that was all he was after, right? Wow, these are good questions I am coming up with, I need to write these down for future reviews... Lol, I'm just kidding...just trying to be funny...but they are good questions I think.
ReplyDeleteOh and to add, you are right with your final few statements... Her knowing would definitely put her life at risk...
ReplyDeleteLOL! Red is Liz's mother?????!!!! What?!
ReplyDeleteI am sorry... I commented to your statement above before reading this one. I pretty much said what you just said that if it was just for The Fulcrum then he would have taken that memory long ago. Very smart Ashley.
I Lol'ed at your statement, "She isn't even a good FBI agent"...Lol, that's funny.
I don't think that Liz is his niece. That seems a little boring and a cop-out like you mention. She is either daughter or not daughter. A friend of mine said something that made a little sense, I would like to know what you (and everyone) think about it. She said that if Red is not her father then this show will become no different than any other FBI procedural. I thought that was a little interesting. Mind you, I do not think the same way. I just like to weigh every possibility because that is what makes the show more fun to watch.
Right now I am 60/40 convinced that Red is her Father. I have always thought of The Blacklist as a "Chosen One" story with Liz being the Chosen-One. So for her to not be Red's daughter would be interesting.
Very good and discerning statements you always seem to have Ashley... I don't know why I just typed that sentence like Yoda, Lol.
I think there are some answers to those questions already established within the series...
ReplyDeleteWhy give himself up to the FBI?
At least in part to use them as a tool to track and eliminate his enemies, both known and unknown. I think the Fulcrum is another reason to connect or reconnect with Liz. It all really comes down to consolidating and fortifying his power base to come out stronger. Of course there could be a yet unseen greater goal... Expose Liz's past? Establish a personal endgame so he can retire, do time or die in peace? So many possibilities.
Why at that time specifically?
The timing had to have been related to Liz graduating from Quantico.
Red's operation was breaking down and using the FBI as protection and enforcer makes a lot of sense. Well assuming one is brilliant enough to jedi mind trick the FBI into working for them! XD
Like so many things on the series the answers to "Why?" and "Why then?" are intertwined with Red's past and Liz's past. We still only have pieces of those puzzles so answers are not yet clear. We just have guesses based on Red's hints and red herrings...
Very good points! Thank you!
ReplyDeleteI will be happy as well when the 'Y' symbol's meaning is revealed, but I am sure that is a far way down the road. I remember you made some very good references to Liz's scar and the meaning behind it last season, so thank you.
I agree with you also about Red's potential last word and thought establishing Liz as his daughter beyond a reasonable doubt. Some fans think so, but I believe we need much more information.
That is a very good point. I think that may be the reason the writers add a little bit of mystery in each episode that touches on the bigger story arc.
ReplyDeleteI don't know that it would necessarily make The Blacklist like any other FBI procedural, but I think it is important for the final answer to be logical, impactful, and true to what has happened thus far on the show. At this point, with the way they have written Red, and with the way Spader has "acted" Red, I feel like the only logical conclusion is him being her father.
ReplyDeleteOtherwise, I think a lot of the things we have witnessed on the show the conversation after her memory retrieval, him saying her name as his last thought, him putting her even above finding about Fitch's last words etc, would seem like blatant "tricks" by the writers. I think perhaps him being her father wasn't even the original main plan, but it seems organic to the storyline now.
I am not sure why The Blacklist has gotten this rep for coming up with "huge" shocks. They do small shocks, but I have yet to see something that really throws me for a loop in their major reveals. But, you know what, that is OK. I think that a sign of good foreshadowing and bad advertising on NBC's part. They build these things up too big.
I think people are something from M. Night Shamalan complex. Everythign has to have some big twist... we see how well that has worked for him after The Sixth Sense. LOL
Exactly.
ReplyDeleteI think many fans see every action or event as a supporting fact to their pet theory, but even when those actions and events are strung together they are not near to being conclusive evidence of anything.
For me personally the question of their exact relationship is almost irrelevant at this point. Time will reveal the details to answer it more directly. Until then REd could have a number of reasons for working with the FBI or for wanting to reconnect with Liz.
True, very true. However, I was thinking that there could possibly be more to it than just eliminating his enemies. You say that his operations were breaking down, but I don't recall that being said ever, was it? I could be mistaken.
ReplyDeleteI also asked, "Why at that time specifically?". I meant in relation to what we know and what we don't know. If he is her father, then why then. If he is not her father and only after The Fulcrum then why give himself up at that time and not sooner?...Questions like that...sorry I should have been more precise, but your answers, as usual, are always great...thank you...
Often times those big twists are cop outs and feel so forced.
ReplyDeleteShamalan's works seem so pedestrian when compared to the complex nature of The Blacklist.
Totally agree on the terrible promotions from NBC. They feed the fire of passionate fans with misdirection and highlight twists that may or may not actually happen... I think their episode promos alienate as much or maybe more than they draw in new viewers.
Very true! Yes! I think the question should take a back seat to more burning questions we have.
ReplyDeleteRed stated numerous times that his organization was under attack and operations had been foiled repeatedly. So I think that could be part of the timing. Just not the only reason.
ReplyDeleteI think the question of "Why not before?" can be answered by the fact he needed to wait for Lizzie to become Agent Keen with the FBI.
Personally I think the Fulcrum is just the next focus and not necessarily the real reason for Red's actions. However, it may be the reason for actions taken against Red!
Had his organization not been under attack, he may not have felt threatened enough to need The Fulcrum available to him in that moment. With how everything played out exposing Berlin as Fitch's tool, then losing his strongest ally within the Cabal, Red may now feels forced to prove he has Fulcrum in his grasp.
Thank you for this! This is awesome!
ReplyDeleteThere are two things I notice about his passport...
1. His "SS" runes are not on his neck in the photo
2. This was something I wanted to, but forgot, to mention in my Review. His passport states Dresden, Germany. Dresden was the location of intense bombing and destruction during WWII with an extremely large amount of casualties. One of my favorite books is Kurt Vonnegut's 'Slaughterhouse Five' which is loosely based on his first-hand experience of the raid as a POW.
Was there something else that you were referring to that I missed? I would love to know, thank you!
Thank you! I had not know that or must have heard that and forgotten. That would explain quite a number of things relating to the timing of the S1E1 events.
ReplyDeleteAnd that is true about needing The Fulcrum more than ever now. With his strongest ally in the cabal now gone, he needs more proof that he is in possession of The Fulcrum.
What question with continuity are you referring to? I'm sorry I must have missed it but I would be glad to give some input.
ReplyDeleteI think the fulcrum is similar to the Berlin arc. I think it will resolve itself sometime this year or next year. I think she is the key to the fulcrum because her and Red were connected all those years ago. I don't think the fulcrum was his original tie to her as in he was trying to just steal the fulcrum from her family. Again, he could work with any FBI team, and it would have been smarter to take the fulcrum back when she was, you know, four... HAHA... Or even 14. I think he didn't want to HAVE to get the fulcrum from her. She trumps his life, that is clear...
ReplyDeleteAnother thing I always think back on to show he truly does value her more than his own personal interests is that he has offered to walk away twice now... Once in the episode with Wilson from house, and once in the Berlin conclusion. I don't think that was for sure either. I think if she truly said... I want you gone, fulcrum or not, he would listen to her. He seems very careful to let her take the lead on a lot of the relationship... (not forcing her to give him the fulcrum, not forcing her to tell him about Tom even though he knew about Tom, etc.). She's most important even above his motives.
ReplyDeleteI think she probably got confused because it said in the post above even the daddy gaters thought a kiss could have happened.
ReplyDeleteAs long as they stop shipping them if it is conclusively revealed they are related... haha... :-)
ReplyDeleteyes, the show writer
ReplyDelete1 what I was trying to point out is that the discussion with Francis is right before the shooting, that is why it is the last thing on Red's mind and he was right. The fun thing is that he then takes the Russian roulette gun and shoots Earl proving his point that Earl would much rather have a walk in the park with a good friend than money at this point.
2 I looked that up before I posted and that was what I found, see if you do not agree that is the image you want.
3 Bud is one of many but how many?
4 In a history repeats itself way, Tom being sent to seduce and watch after Lizzie is established. Tom knowing and reporting to Red and Berlin is established. Tom still trying to watch after Lizzie is established. Nothing left in this deal but to show all the cards and let the winner win.
5 a man he has never met so man could be used same as person, asset, buyer,boss, et al.
I would still be looking for a woman at this point.
Yeah I think I heard it in that Walter Mitty movie! Otherwise Under Pressure is the only David Bowie song I've heard. I think I might have heard Rocket Man a loooooong time ago. I'll have a listen.
ReplyDeleteDefinitely, especially since they never ever give any verbal clues, only visual ones! If we didn't know better, it would seem that the symbols mean nothing at all!
I am so excited!!! This episode was truly one of the best of the season
Well, we don't actually know for certain if they are related, but either way, Red has always had a very paternal relationship with her, so yeah. I'm just... shocked.
ReplyDeleteI'll consider myself lucky that I am not so deep into some fandoms.
ReplyDeleteFor the record, I agree that the James and Megan work brilliantly off each other, but for me it's always been a very paternal chemistry.
People can ship whatever they wish, in the end. :) I don't wish to spread hate, I was just honestly shocked at the prospect. It never once crossed my mind.
I agree with D.Mode, Because of Berlin and Tom, he picked that moment because of her graduation Quantico and my head canon is that Fate as he said brought them together, maybe he saved her from the fire, maybe gave her to Sam to take care of - maybe gave his word to her father, we all know Red is a man of his word and duty bound. I believe that he gradually grew to care more for her as the seasons progressed, he has been watching over her over the past 2 decades, lost his family probably due to the Fulcrum, as he said in 209 - Liz is his ray of light, she is his second chance - his way of redeeming himself. If he does right by her, would it negate everything he has done wrong in the past?...the monster becoming human again - It kind of reminds me of the beautiful tale of Beauty & The beast - The one person who could make him want to change, not necessarily as her father, but as a man.
ReplyDeleteI believe that as long as she was safe, the fulcrum was as well and if not for Berlin/Tom, Red would still lurk around in the shadows. Moreover, not one of his enemies/Agents have mentioned Liz as his 'possible' daughter, Not Zumani, Anslo, Madeline, Berlin, Tom, Braxton, Ressler in fact if he was, than we would need a talk with the ambiguish wording of the writers as: 1) If anyone ask, you are my girlfriend of Ann Harbour, 2) the sexcapades/dirty talk, 3) The old dog still got the touch, 4) She is a little young for you, 5) You are not in love with Reddington 6) Lover's quarrel 7) in the doghouse 8) Your girlfriend, the princess 9) The tango 10) You care as much for her, as you care for your wife!
- yeah i don't know if that is the way to write a Father/Daughter relationship, but that is up for debate. ;-) We could argue the interpretations of monologues/scenes until the sun comes up. I respect everyone's opinions in this regard, in the end, we could all be very wrong.
Actually this comment was said by someone who does believe they are related, people tend to change their minds and perspective all the time, that is the beauty of this show. No one is right or wrong, yet.
ReplyDeleteIt was a daddygater who said that ;-) that is what is so funny. The UST was palpable. I respect everyone's opinion, but that was low lol.
ReplyDeleteHAHA! if they pull a dan test out of their box, trust me, we will, but they won't ;-)
ReplyDeleteI see Liz as Red's redemption also....
ReplyDeleteI just cannot settle on if it redemption as a man or as a father, or both! XD
You are welcome Geo, Yes there are far more important questions that need answers for now. One thing we can't dispute is that Red/Lizzie's relationship is the golden goose of the show, no matter if they are related or not. Actually this is Hudson 3.0, the first died, the second had some contractual problems lol, I put out a BOLO on the dog and it made John Bokenkamp laugh and even retweeted it my missing Dog poster.
ReplyDeleteFans are far more observant than TPTB believe we are. We notice every detail, dissect the episode's down to it's undies, just as you do ;-) No worries about not being able to write them all down, that is what comments are for, to elaborate more and read other people's thoughts. We all watch the show through different eyes and see what we want to see. That is Very interesting - to me at least.
Yes, i wish Red would be upset with madeline too! but that scene with him and Lizzie in the motel said enough, it is some weird, twisted game they play and i don't think that Madeline believed that Red wouldn't come out of it alive. He always did in the past. Lizzie however, will be furious and maybe we will see a primitive Bitch fight in the future hehe.
Hudson the dog with shrinkism and plastic surgery, we will see him again some day, maybe in Dembe's or Mr.Vargas's care lol. Thank you for your answers.
Oh wow thank you for that part of Dresden, that was new to me - i do know that the black lions are significant in German history and could relate to his new/old tattoos? they don't appear to be as fresh as his SS tattoos.
ReplyDeleteGeo, I meant the dates 4-26-1979, 4-26-1999 ,4-26-1919? And it is a horrible fake, unlamented passport [i am dutch and have german relatives with real passports] I hope TPTB will pay a little more attention to continuity, because we Sherlock the hell out of it, from the paintings to tattoos, the horrible timeline, to their appearing/disappearing scars ;-)
Agree on Madeline. I am sure he is "mad," but that is the world Red is in. Remember, he said something similar to Ressler when he saved him in Anslo Garrick. He saved a man's life, then the man tried to kill him a couple months later.. He said something like, "The needle in your arm becomes the one in your neck..." He doesn't live in a world of "friends" the way we know them. HAHA
ReplyDeleteYou already answered, thank you :)
ReplyDeleteHe, Emily ditto - i don't hate on no one, everyone sees and believes what they want too - i am more than fine with it. I wish everyone could be as graceful and respectful of other people's opinions. There is even something called shipper wars - i just try to stay clear from all the drama and enjoy the show :) Yes, consider yourself Lucky.
ReplyDeleteShe will be back in 2x19! love Kate, Mr.Vargas, Jellybean actually Red's team of eccentric, quirky people are pretty awesome.
ReplyDeleteUnfortunately I have seen more than my fair share of 'shipper wars' in other fandoms, and it's, by far, the most irritating part of being immersed in a fandom! It can ruin the fun of it, so I make a habit of avoiding it at all costs - but sometimes it sneaks through. I sincerely wish more shippers could just respect differing opinions.
ReplyDeleteOne day Em, i hope we can all be adults about it - i have met some incredible people in every fandom, who i consider my friends, despite our different 'ships' - some unfortunately are just *sneeze* Drama Queens. That is why you have the Mute/Block Button, no matter from which ship it comes from.
ReplyDeleteOne day, indeed! Fingers crossed. Totally agree about the mute/block options - some people just enjoy being bullies.
ReplyDeleteMistakes like those are why I don't put too much stalk in prop clues. A bunch of people pointed to the second gun click in the scene where Red says Lizzie's name as evidence he knew she was there, but sounds are added later by a sound editor. So, you can't trust that.
ReplyDeleteI actually think "Red" isn't her father... His other identity is. I think there were two families and some kind of CIA operation. I hope that doesn't sound as crazy as the people who think he is her mom. (through a sex change). haha.. LOL
ReplyDeleteYeah maybe...
ReplyDeleteThat seems to attempt to cut it down the middle with him both being her father and not being her father. It leaves me conflicted honestly, but at this point I think any answer will leave me a little conflicted...
I would prefer Red willingly acknowledge that a previous identity and his current one are the same whether he parses words or not... Although personally I am not a fan of Red being someone other than Red since all his records point to him not having a new or different identity.
Oh well, that's not gonna be revealed soon so I'm not concerned just yet.
I respect all opinions....but can never be down with incest.
ReplyDeleteI get that we don't know that they are related....but we kinda know....all the clues are there.....why would Red after all want to work with an unknown...protect said unknown over his own life....unless they are in some way related.....
Pure Folly!
ReplyDeleteI will call it how I see it. Thank you muchly!
ReplyDeleteSorry, I don't agree with not seeing it as incestuous....
To me, all points refer to these two being related in some way.
Not to mention....if they were to be in some sort of romance....it would allude to all manner of crazy....it would mean that Red stalked her at a very young and tender age, as he knew all about her, before Liz knew anything about him. This would be sending all the wrong messaging to female viewers....IMO
But eh, to each their own!
I think the Red and Liz scenes were shot or should have taken place before their fall out. Liz now comes across as inconsistent in her behaviour.....
ReplyDeleteAgreed!
ReplyDeleteDaniel, what do you consider higher quality TV?
ReplyDeleteI myself enjoy entertaining shows. No reality crap.
Ashley, just like I stated in an earlier post. I too get the feeling Red is her father. Just the other night I said to my brother imagine if Liz has "feelings" for Red? That certainly would be creepy! Most likely that's why they haven't gone that route at all during the show's run. I also feel something's up with Aram and Navabi. (Did I get her name right this time? Lol)
ReplyDeleteI have mix feelings about the Red says Liz's name as his last words. For his reaction it is clear that he didnt know that she was there or that she was going to help him. But I found kind of out of character is exactly that. I dont see Red as the type of men who said last words. I dunno maybe im just being an idiot but to tell you the truh, I fount it a little bit cheesy. On the otehr hand i understand that he really thought he was gonna die and those final words were a way to say sorry for everything, right?.
ReplyDeleteIt was an excellent episode. That phone call with Tom was unnexpected. I never thought he would risk to talk to Liz and Liz willing to hear what he had to say.
I really should've seen coming that the guy that helped Cooper wasnt on his side at all. I expect Cooper tuning him down the enxt time he comes asking for something, it looks like he accepts he is going to die and that the clinical trial is no longer an option for him.
That final conversation was so well done. It's true what Liz said. Red never had someone to take care of him, he has always been the one to take care of others and it speaks a lot of how their relationship has grown. No matter if they are family or not for real. They are a team, they are friends. And i like that.
Great review. it has been a while since i read one.
LOL! Yoda. That's hilarious!
ReplyDeleteRon that's exactly how I feel. You hit the nail on the head.
ReplyDeleteYou're right. He just doesn't seem the type like you said.
I liked the call from Tom. Even I learned something
with that one. Hope "the sneeze" works as well for me!
Great points Ron! It was an excellent episode. Thanks for the nice words you had to say also.
ReplyDeleteI don't think you are an idiot, some people think that was a cheesy scene, everyone has there take on what really happened.
I didn't expect Tom to return the way he did either - with just a phone call to Liz. I was expecting something much more grand.
Very good point Ashley, sometimes I get the feeling that what I think is a clue is nothing at all. It's not until I watch the episode again and again that I realize what I should be focusing on and what is background noise.
ReplyDeleteI think Liz has been inconsistent with her behavior since S1E1, to be honest. She flip-flops her feelings for Red quite a bit. The past few episodes Liz has been upset with Red and felt disconnected from him. That scene at the end of this episode shows how she really and truly cares for him...again...
ReplyDeleteHigh Quality TV means TV that is amazing; Smart, great acting and writing, direction is top notch, etc.
ReplyDeleteThat certainly is a rarity today.
ReplyDeleteThere's a lot of great TV.
ReplyDeleteGood points Ashley.
ReplyDelete