Lance is turning on Oliver :( I knew it was coming but it still hurts.
"I don't know why I'm doing this anymore" Honestly Oliver you haven't been doing anything lately :\ pull yourself together and go back to being a hero :\
Yeah, that was surprising, I guess she's training with the wig on to get more used to it/ comfortable with it? Because I don't think KC have gone full blonde.
If it is Laurel in the lair training with Nyssa why is she wearing a wig? Is that Roy? Huh? Oh Oliver would you snap out of it and take charge. This crisis is annoying.
He's been trying. Dude just feels lost and beaten. He's whole sense of self is brilliant on the idea that he's the protector of Starling City, that he is good, and almost unbeatable in a fight. And with Sara's death, the team moving on by themselves, losing to Ra's, having to work with Malcolm at the time, that image is broken. It just seems like he feels lost.
This is why I love that they decided to adapt Batman's storyline. They destroyed Oliver's private life first. Company gone. Mother one. Felicity went for another man. THere's no more place for Oliver Queen to exist outside of being a brother to Thea. Then they started to dismantle his Arrow persona. First Ra's beat him and humiliated hi (and fighting seemed like the last thing Oliver was supposed to be good at), then, after he crawled back to Starling he learned his team managed just fine without him. So there's increasingly less and less place for Arrow too. Which means, that unlike with Batman, you can actually see how Ra's offer might be extremely tempting for Oliver, because at this point he would probably be happier in League than in Starling. Batman never would take Ra's offer. Oliver might.
You make a couple of really interesting observations there. Well spotted that the 'Oliver Queen' side of him have been dismantled (no money, no company, no family at first (mother dead, Thea left town) and that's might explain his focus on the "Arrow" part of himself for the first part of the season. Now the fight with Ra's is breaking down his Arrow persona as well.
You've given me some interesting food for thought and perhaps diminished my intense dislike of Oliver this year a bit.
I hope this eventually leads to a rebuilding of both parts. A new 'Oliver Queen' (His company back) and a new 'Arrow' (perhaps a little lighter, able to enjoy himself more)
Agreed. Hell apart of me hopes he makes it for an ep or two then something cathartic happens that reminds him that Oliver is needed and has a purpose. That's the one thing about Batman why stuff like this could never be explored, he's too obsessive about the mission. I'd argue even the brother bit is fading, Thea no longer needs to be saved to his knowledge from the league. And that was the one thing driving him and keeping him going.
I don't think they're training... I think they're getting back and find her fighting with Thea, so they obiously have to but in and "sabe" her, eventhough we've seen Thea doesn't need saving...
I don't know why Ollie is doing this either. He's not the same as he was in the past two seasons as he feels different now when he's The Arrow. Perhaps it could be solely based on the idea that at least he was trying to be both vigilante/hero and Oliver Queen. With him deciding to basically only be The Arrow, I think it's made him lose the essence of why he even bothered to save Starling.
Agree 100%. It's not about "This is a Batman story!" anyways. These are all DC characters and the stories have to make sense. Not only does this idea make sense because it could be suggested that this whole idea started once Ollie lost the company back in S2, but this is also the finest story one could tell when using Ra's al Ghul. The other one is actually trying to destroy a city and its people and you can watch Batman Begins or play Arkham City to see that aspect. When Ra's al Ghul wanted Batman to be his heir, that's the story one usually thinks of when they think of Ra's al Ghul as much as one thinks of Knightfall when they think of Bane. And Ollie makes so much more sense to be in this position than Batman anyways, and you just listed some great points as to why it makes sense.
He's supposed to find himself, reconcile both his identities and realize that he can't be a hero if he lost himself and everything/everyone he cares about. He just needs to get there faster because this is getting tiresome.
Stephen Amell basically hinted at a "re-building" of Oliver Queen and the other persona for season four, so I think it definitely makes sense to see a different side of Ollie as well as a different side of the 'Arrow' persona.
Well, yah. I agree; he is supposed to find himself, but he's not doing a great way at doing such because he's basically taking baby steps in trying to reconcile his image as a brother but nothing else when it comes to being Oliver Queen. Honestly, I wonder if Diggle dying wouldn't push Ollie in the right direction.
I'd like that, I want to see an Oliver that manages to be both a responsible CEO for his company while still managing his night time crime fighting activities and being a good leader/mentor/friend.
Not only that, but a more vocal Oliver Queen too that would then think about running for mayor or at least an alderman for The Glades since he spent so much time in the series in trying to save it.
There could be one, but Diggle represents what Ollie cannot be; he represents the better part of humanity which Ollie has lost over the years and if Diggle were to die, that would be a calling for Ollie as he would need to respect that man Diggle tried to make him become as much as he has respected the likes of Yao Fei, Shado and to an extent what Maseo has taught him.
Not gonna lie; I really do enjoy this take of Oliver Queen. They have portrayed his womanizing ways even after retuning from the island, they have showed his intense passion in trying to save his city as well as him not being able to find a purpose as Oliver Queen but now this is the moment, just like in the comics, where Ollie needs to step up as Oliver Queen and do something with his life because he can't do all of it as a hero. I think this is the perfect part in the series too to do such. Plus, I admire that the writers have made him more cynical than just witty/humorous. I prefer the more cynical take and not the take that just makes you think they're trying to go for the Robert Downey, Jr. as Tony Stark approach.
That's not the vibe I got from Nyssa at all. I thought all she wanted was to execute the guy who killed Sara. She did not show any interest in giving Merlyn a fair fight. She just wanted to capture him, take him to Nanda Parbat and kill him.
I have a feeling Laurel and Roy will come to the lair see Thea kneeling infront of Nyssa who has the sword ready to kill her and they will fight her. Of course Laurel being the uber person she is will be able to let Nyssa understand Thea is innocent in this crime.
Maybe the fact that Thea honorably surrendered herself will make Nyssa give her a chance to defend herself... I know you're not serious, but I'm looking forward to Laurel talking her down and making her understand Thea wasn't herself when she did it...
After telling Roy she felt bad for turning him into the LoA? I don't think she'd do it, not now... But that would certainly be interesting. If it turns out to be her, I wonder how Ollie will take Thea not having a soul to be saved...
I do hope they will eventually arrive at the cocky fun loving Oliver we know from comics, but for now I'm enjoying the road there. What makes Arrow fascinating for me is how dynamic character Oliver is. Superheroes aren't usually dynamic. They make at most a change in their short origin story and even that doesn't happen always. Look at Barry, he's the same lovable guy he always was, just with powers and we know nothing will ever make him truly change. Which is fine for him, but GA is different even in comics. And in show he's going through huge changes season by season, especially since we also are witnessing his descent into darkness by flashbacks. Ultimately I think he will loosen up (we already saw glimpses of that when he's more comfortable with his situation, like in early S2 or when he came to Central city) and just have fun. But to do that he needs his Oliver persona back. What always made Oliver Queen in comic book a much less tortured soul than Batman (and that's despite Olie being a killer from time to time) is ability to balance his vigilante and public life. Oliver Queen is much more active in his city than Bruce Wayne is in his. He's philanthropist and has very good public image (none of that irresponsible playboy crap). Enough that it wasn't surprise when he became a mayor. I hope that ultimately this is where Arrow will lead Oliver too.
I know CL is going to be in the spinoff, but is it confirmed she's coming back? I really don't want resurrections in this show, literal ones, I mean. And ve Nyssa and Laurel, but I just want them bonding as friends, I'm really tired of the whole sister boyfriend/girlfriend swapping on this show.
MG said on tumblr "Sara's return won't affect Laurel's story line". He specifically said Sara so everyone believes CL will be reprising the same role. I hated Malcolm's resurrection. Slade's made more sense as we never saw him being dead like Malcolm. I hope it is an alternate universe Sara or a clone. That being said I don't want CL to play any other character in the same universe.
Nyssa and Laurel is going to be only friends. Maybe not even friends but a mentor/trainee relationship like May/Skye in AoS. Agreed enough with passing the parcel dating in the family as if there is no one else in the world.
I hate resurrections of any kind, but this kind of resurrection, bringing back from the dead someone that was really dead, it nullifies death. This is why I dreaded the lazarus pit, it takes us dangerously close to TVD territory, where death means absolutely nothing because you know anyone can comeback and no one stays dead for long...
Well they can get away with it if they make the pit (if they are using it) a one time only resurrection deal. The pit will heal wounds but it can only bring back a person from death only once. After that the power is gone. Ra's might know a few of them. This magical powers of pit and even flying ATOM tech suit kind of looks out of place in Arrow and the world they have created.
That's my problem with all this. What I like about Arrow is the same thing I liked about TDK, it kept things as real as possible. If they actually dabble in this territory there's no way back... I don't want to jump ahead of myself, but the more I think about it, the more it looks the may go down that path... If they do, let's hope they put clear guidelines from the get go that show that it's not a magic trick that can be used the momento they regret a death...
Whatever they do I hope they make sure it is a one time thing and will never happen. I disliked the Mirakuru story line for the same reason. Super strength? ugh. I should have known they would go more bizzare and been prepared.
NOTE: Name-calling, personal attacks, spamming, excessive self-promotion, condescending pomposity, general assiness, racism, sexism, any-other-ism, homophobia, acrophobia, and destructive (versus constructive) criticism will get you BANNED from the party.
did Laurel go full blonde? because if not then who's that blonde?
ReplyDeleteAre Laurel and Dig fighting Nyssa? Maybe to protect Thea?
ReplyDeleteProbably.
ReplyDeleteMy first submission, I feel proud :D
ReplyDeleteLance is turning on Oliver :( I knew it was coming but it still hurts.
"I don't know why I'm doing this anymore" Honestly Oliver you haven't been doing anything lately :\ pull yourself together and go back to being a hero :\
But where is Thea herself? And if she is fighting them then why would she help Laurel later?
ReplyDeleteYes, is Laurel
ReplyDeleteThey are training, i guess
ReplyDeleteNo idea. All of this is speculation anyway.
ReplyDeleteDig training with Nyssa? Feels unlikely to me.
ReplyDeleteLaurel wears street clothes so doesn't seem like that.
ReplyDeleteGood questions. I changed my mind seems more like Roy, cause Laurel is wearing the clothes from 3x15 and Dig would still be in NP when this happens.
ReplyDeleteMaybe Nyssa already knocked out Thea and after the fight Laurel will explain Nyssa that Thea got drugged.
Yeah, that was surprising, I guess she's training with the wig on to get more used to it/ comfortable with it? Because I don't think KC have gone full blonde.
ReplyDeleteWhy would she only knock out Thea and not kill her? Doesn't sound like something Nyssa would do.
ReplyDeleteProbably just didn't have time to finish it.
ReplyDeletehttp://media0.giphy.com/media/CatCCFZa6U8nK/giphy.gif
hahahahah
ReplyDeleteLaurel and Roy
ReplyDeleteIf it is Laurel in the lair training with Nyssa why is she wearing a wig? Is that Roy? Huh?
ReplyDeleteOh Oliver would you snap out of it and take charge. This crisis is annoying.
;-) ^_^
ReplyDeleteHe's been trying. Dude just feels lost and beaten. He's whole sense of self is brilliant on the idea that he's the protector of Starling City, that he is good, and almost unbeatable in a fight. And with Sara's death, the team moving on by themselves, losing to Ra's, having to work with Malcolm at the time, that image is broken. It just seems like he feels lost.
ReplyDeleteI'm just getting a black screen. Has anyone found it on YT yet?
ReplyDeletehttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nBt1cgT9MZo
ReplyDeleteThanks so much.
ReplyDeleteI get all that I'm just starting to get annoyed. I want my bada** hero back ASAP.
ReplyDeleteThis is why I love that they decided to adapt Batman's storyline. They destroyed Oliver's private life first. Company gone. Mother one. Felicity went for another man. THere's no more place for Oliver Queen to exist outside of being a brother to Thea. Then they started to dismantle his Arrow persona. First Ra's beat him and humiliated hi (and fighting seemed like the last thing Oliver was supposed to be good at), then, after he crawled back to Starling he learned his team managed just fine without him. So there's increasingly less and less place for Arrow too. Which means, that unlike with Batman, you can actually see how Ra's offer might be extremely tempting for Oliver, because at this point he would probably be happier in League than in Starling. Batman never would take Ra's offer. Oliver might.
ReplyDeleteYou make a couple of really interesting observations there. Well spotted that the 'Oliver Queen' side of him have been dismantled (no money, no company, no family at first (mother dead, Thea left town) and that's might explain his focus on the "Arrow" part of himself for the first part of the season. Now the fight with Ra's is breaking down his Arrow persona as well.
ReplyDeleteYou've given me some interesting food for thought and perhaps diminished my intense dislike of Oliver this year a bit.
I hope this eventually leads to a rebuilding of both parts. A new 'Oliver Queen' (His company back) and a new 'Arrow' (perhaps a little lighter, able to enjoy himself more)
Plus, love your David Styles icon.
Nyssa al Ghul Wins!!
ReplyDeleteWe all do. That and I really want to see the next Flash episode.
ReplyDeleteWhat kind of fatality would Nyssa have then.
ReplyDeleteSame here.
ReplyDeleteAgreed. Hell apart of me hopes he makes it for an ep or two then something cathartic happens that reminds him that Oliver is needed and has a purpose. That's the one thing about Batman why stuff like this could never be explored, he's too obsessive about the mission. I'd argue even the brother bit is fading, Thea no longer needs to be saved to his knowledge from the league. And that was the one thing driving him and keeping him going.
ReplyDeleteIt's gonna be so awesome. Wells' reveals he's the Reverse-Flash. I'm a be in a nerd coma for like a day.
ReplyDeleteHmm just to be a dick, she does a babality.
ReplyDeleteNerd coma hahaha
ReplyDeleteWho said that Wells is going to reveal his secret? I think Cisco is going to figure it out.
I don't think they're training... I think they're getting back and find her fighting with Thea, so they obiously have to but in and "sabe" her, eventhough we've seen Thea doesn't need saving...
ReplyDeleteI can't wait to see what the Asia promo will show, lol.
ReplyDeleteShe's "full blonde" when she's Black Canary because she's wearing a wig similar to what Sara wore.
ReplyDeleteThat makes more sense. As long as he does something speed force-y.
ReplyDeleteShe was probably interrupted by them getting back from "saving the city"...
ReplyDeleteProbably things they shouldn't, LOL! like they always do...
ReplyDeleteI don't know why Ollie is doing this either. He's not the same as he was in the past two seasons as he feels different now when he's The Arrow. Perhaps it could be solely based on the idea that at least he was trying to be both vigilante/hero and Oliver Queen. With him deciding to basically only be The Arrow, I think it's made him lose the essence of why he even bothered to save Starling.
ReplyDeleteI think Big Daddy Warner was going to have a serious talk to Warner Asia about their promos and we will no longer get major spoilers that way.
ReplyDeleteCan't wait to see what will make Cisco suspect Wells since he was so against admitting that Wells might be a bad guy.
ReplyDeleteAgree 100%. It's not about "This is a Batman story!" anyways. These are all DC characters and the stories have to make sense. Not only does this idea make sense because it could be suggested that this whole idea started once Ollie lost the company back in S2, but this is also the finest story one could tell when using Ra's al Ghul. The other one is actually trying to destroy a city and its people and you can watch Batman Begins or play Arkham City to see that aspect. When Ra's al Ghul wanted Batman to be his heir, that's the story one usually thinks of when they think of Ra's al Ghul as much as one thinks of Knightfall when they think of Bane. And Ollie makes so much more sense to be in this position than Batman anyways, and you just listed some great points as to why it makes sense.
ReplyDeleteHe's supposed to find himself, reconcile both his identities and realize that he can't be a hero if he lost himself and everything/everyone he cares about. He just needs to get there faster because this is getting tiresome.
ReplyDeleteStephen Amell basically hinted at a "re-building" of Oliver Queen and the other persona for season four, so I think it definitely makes sense to see a different side of Ollie as well as a different side of the 'Arrow' persona.
ReplyDeleteI don't think they were "saving the city" there are no buckles in the scene lol
ReplyDeleteDo you think that's why the one for "Nanda Parbat" didn't show anything new?
ReplyDeleteHe's gonna be sad. Then I'm going be sad because Cisco and Barry are going to be. And Caitlin.
ReplyDeleteWell, yah. I agree; he is supposed to find himself, but he's not doing a great way at doing such because he's basically taking baby steps in trying to reconcile his image as a brother but nothing else when it comes to being Oliver Queen. Honestly, I wonder if Diggle dying wouldn't push Ollie in the right direction.
ReplyDeleteI'd like that, I want to see an Oliver that manages to be both a responsible CEO for his company while still managing his night time crime fighting activities and being a good leader/mentor/friend.
ReplyDeleteNot only that, but a more vocal Oliver Queen too that would then think about running for mayor or at least an alderman for The Glades since he spent so much time in the series in trying to save it.
ReplyDeleteYeah, Guggenheim did mention that they were on it about the major spoilers from Asia.
ReplyDeleteOh yes, definatly want to see the Mayor Queen storyline adapted eventually.
ReplyDeleteNow I am sad.
ReplyDeleteLet's hope he finds another motivation.
ReplyDeleteProbably not since apparently they got a very stern talking to lol
ReplyDeleteThere could be one, but Diggle represents what Ollie cannot be; he represents the better part of humanity which Ollie has lost over the years and if Diggle were to die, that would be a calling for Ollie as he would need to respect that man Diggle tried to make him become as much as he has respected the likes of Yao Fei, Shado and to an extent what Maseo has taught him.
ReplyDeleteGood; glad to hear that. It was annoying watching their promos every week and be spoiled before the episode even aired.
ReplyDeleteBut does Thea want to fight Nyssa. I thought last episode she just surrendered. Maybe Nyssa will ask Thea to fight.
ReplyDeleteNot gonna lie; I really do enjoy this take of Oliver Queen. They have portrayed his womanizing ways even after retuning from the island, they have showed his intense passion in trying to save his city as well as him not being able to find a purpose as Oliver Queen but now this is the moment, just like in the comics, where Ollie needs to step up as Oliver Queen and do something with his life because he can't do all of it as a hero. I think this is the perfect part in the series too to do such. Plus, I admire that the writers have made him more cynical than just witty/humorous. I prefer the more cynical take and not the take that just makes you think they're trying to go for the Robert Downey, Jr. as Tony Stark approach.
ReplyDelete2 Steps From Hell music
ReplyDeleteThe go to guys for epic trailer music
ReplyDeleteI didn't know that! Good thing, now I won't have to avoid them ;-)
ReplyDeleteI don't think Nyssa would accept that, though, it wouldn't be justice unless they gave a fair fight...
ReplyDeleteme too icant wait eithere
ReplyDeleteCongrats lol
ReplyDeleteThat's not the vibe I got from Nyssa at all. I thought all she wanted was to execute the guy who killed Sara. She did not show any interest in giving Merlyn a fair fight. She just wanted to capture him, take him to Nanda Parbat and kill him.
ReplyDeleteI have a feeling Laurel and Roy will come to the lair see Thea kneeling infront of Nyssa who has the sword ready to kill her and they will fight her. Of course Laurel being the uber person she is will be able to let Nyssa understand Thea is innocent in this crime.
Maybe the fact that Thea honorably surrendered herself will make Nyssa give her a chance to defend herself...
ReplyDeleteI know you're not serious, but I'm looking forward to Laurel talking her down and making her understand Thea wasn't herself when she did it...
epic promo. I kind of hope Oliver becomes Ra's al Ghul's student for a while
ReplyDeleteI'm pretty sure the person approaching Malcolm with a knife in hand is Thea, so maybe Nyssa asks her to kill him????
ReplyDeleteAfter telling Roy she felt bad for turning him into the LoA? I don't think she'd do it, not now... But that would certainly be interesting. If it turns out to be her, I wonder how Ollie will take Thea not having a soul to be saved...
ReplyDeleteI do hope they will eventually arrive at the cocky fun loving Oliver we know from comics, but for now I'm enjoying the road there. What makes Arrow fascinating for me is how dynamic character Oliver is. Superheroes aren't usually dynamic. They make at most a change in their short origin story and even that doesn't happen always. Look at Barry, he's the same lovable guy he always was, just with powers and we know nothing will ever make him truly change. Which is fine for him, but GA is different even in comics. And in show he's going through huge changes season by season, especially since we also are witnessing his descent into darkness by flashbacks.
ReplyDeleteUltimately I think he will loosen up (we already saw glimpses of that when he's more comfortable with his situation, like in early S2 or when he came to Central city) and just have fun. But to do that he needs his Oliver persona back. What always made Oliver Queen in comic book a much less tortured soul than Batman (and that's despite Olie being a killer from time to time) is ability to balance his vigilante and public life. Oliver Queen is much more active in his city than Bruce Wayne is in his. He's philanthropist and has very good public image (none of that irresponsible playboy crap). Enough that it wasn't surprise when he became a mayor. I hope that ultimately this is where Arrow will lead Oliver too.
I am looking forward to Laurel and Nyssa bonding too. I am wondering how this is all going to work once Sara comes back into picture.
ReplyDeleteif you say so, it just doesn't look very wig-y
ReplyDeleteI know CL is going to be in the spinoff, but is it confirmed she's coming back? I really don't want resurrections in this show, literal ones, I mean.
ReplyDeleteAnd ve Nyssa and Laurel, but I just want them bonding as friends, I'm really tired of the whole sister boyfriend/girlfriend swapping on this show.
Just look up recent pics of Katie; she's not blonde.
ReplyDeleteMG said on tumblr "Sara's return won't affect Laurel's story line". He specifically said Sara so everyone believes CL will be reprising the same role. I hated Malcolm's resurrection. Slade's made more sense as we never saw him being dead like Malcolm. I hope it is an alternate universe Sara or a clone. That being said I don't want CL to play any other character in the same universe.
ReplyDeleteNyssa and Laurel is going to be only friends. Maybe not even friends but a mentor/trainee relationship like May/Skye in AoS. Agreed enough with passing the parcel dating in the family as if there is no one else in the world.
I hate resurrections of any kind, but this kind of resurrection, bringing back from the dead someone that was really dead, it nullifies death. This is why I dreaded the lazarus pit, it takes us dangerously close to TVD territory, where death means absolutely nothing because you know anyone can comeback and no one stays dead for long...
ReplyDeleteWell they can get away with it if they make the pit (if they are using it) a one time only resurrection deal. The pit will heal wounds but it can only bring back a person from death only once. After that the power is gone. Ra's might know a few of them. This magical powers of pit and even flying ATOM tech suit kind of looks out of place in Arrow and the world they have created.
ReplyDeleteThat's my problem with all this. What I like about Arrow is the same thing I liked about TDK, it kept things as real as possible. If they actually dabble in this territory there's no way back... I don't want to jump ahead of myself, but the more I think about it, the more it looks the may go down that path... If they do, let's hope they put clear guidelines from the get go that show that it's not a magic trick that can be used the momento they regret a death...
ReplyDeleteWhatever they do I hope they make sure it is a one time thing and will never happen. I disliked the Mirakuru story line for the same reason. Super strength? ugh. I should have known they would go more bizzare and been prepared.
ReplyDeleteThe pit can only ressurrect the dead if the body is not too bady damage and the dead only been dead for a short time
ReplyDeleteWe can only hope now, whatever is going to happen, it's already happened.
ReplyDelete