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Supernatural - Fan Fiction - Review - "Supersize 200th Episode Edition"

Nov 12, 2014

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Supernatural celebrated 200 episodes this week with “Fan Fiction.” This is a milestone very few series ever reach, and 10 years ago I bet there were few people who believed the show would make it. But the title is an homage to the fans who dared to hope the show would continue and whose support made it happen. The episode was written by Robbie Thompson and directed by Phil Sgriccia. I can’t wait to see what other fans thought of the episode. While I thought the “meta” in this episode took me out of the episode itself, I still thoroughly enjoyed the attention to so many things the fans have asked about time and time again. Clearly, the writers heard the fans’ pleas even when the answers didn’t come in quite the ways we expected.

I’ll be especially curious to find out what viewers who aren’t immersed in fan culture thought of the episode. Were there too many in-jokes? Too many “technical” fan culture terms? Surely, there must be a faction of viewers who don’t follow that aspect of the show – Supernatural has casual viewers too, right?

It strikes me that casual viewers might not have realized that the person who uses the publisher ticket turns out to be none other than Chuck – Carver Edlund (Rob Benedict) – the writer of the Supernatural books, last seen in “Swan Song,” when he was clearly identified as both God and Eric Kripke – and he disappeared. Ending the episode this way, was the perfect bookend to the episode as the only element to the “THEN” montage at the beginning is a typed page with Supernatural, “The Pilot” created by Eric Kripke – just as God created the world, Kripke created this one. And hey, writers? Since you are clearly paying attention to us, now that Chuck IS back in the world, we’d really, really like to see him in another episode – preferably kicking Metatron’s (Curtis Armstrong) ass. But even just as Chuck the writer would be fine. Am I the only one who squeeed when we saw Rob’s face?

All of the press leading up to this episode underscored from cast, writers, and producers that this episode was a love letter to the fans, so my hope is that the fans take it in that way because there is plenty to squee about in this episode. The stage show itself, helps to set the stage (pun intended) for the episode, we have a teaser within a teaser. Director Marie (Katie Sarife) is immediately concerned that her cast isn’t taking her script seriously. The scene they are filming pre-dates “Dark Side of the Moon” (the episode in which the brothers go to Heaven, Cas (Misha Collins) learns the ‘samulet’ won’t find God, and Dean (Jensen Ackles) throws it away), so Marie wants to know why Siobhan – “Dean” (Alyssa Lynch) – isn’t wearing it. Siobhan tells her it kept hitting her in the lips, so she took it off. This is a nod to the fact that Ackles lobbied to get rid of the prop because it did keep hitting him in the face – painfully, and chipping his teeth! We learn that Siobhan is not crazily committed to the part and only wants credit for college applications.

The first victim of the “real” case is the drama teacher, Mrs Chandler (Alberta Mayne). She is going to stop the play because there’s too much drama in the drama department. This is also a nice reference to the drama which also erupts in fandom. She wants to know why they couldn’t just do Godspell and insists that Supernatural doesn’t make good theatre because it isn’t about life. Of course, it is. Ultimately, the monster in this episode is Calliope (Hannah Levien) – the Goddess of epic poetry or the muse. Calliope points out why Supernatural is special and why it attracted her – and SO many fan fiction writers: “Supernatural has everything. Life. Death. Resurrection. Redemption. But above all family. All set to music you can really tap your toe to. It isn’t some meandering piece of genre drech. It’s epic.” Her description sounds a lot like Kripke’s initial pitch for the show, but also like so many answers to why do you write fan fiction for this show.

One of the signatures of the show has always been the title card that changes for every season. This time we go from the stage shows version, which Marie says needs more effects, which she articulates by hand waving. What follows is then a lovely montage of most of the title cards we’ve seen over the years, including all the special one-offs. You can see it and the rest of the title cards here. Loved it! It’s also a nice homage to the effects team who have done an amazing job over the years with a pretty limited budget.

The first scene with the actual Winchesters is another fan present. Dean, in a t-shirt working on Baby’s (the Impala) engine. We get a great shot of her sweet, pristinely clean engine. Thanks so much for putting all the grease on Ackles… We also hear some great classic rock playing – Gordon Lightfoot’s “Sundown.” It’s a nice nod to the Canadian roots of the show. We then move to the trunk and some long, loving shots of all the tools of the trade that fans have come to know and love over the years. Sam (Jared Padalecki) then comes out of room 200 to join his brother at the trunk. Dean is eager to get back on the road. He’s rested and back to their “normal.” Sam is skeptical that there is a case, but agrees to check it out. And then we have another fan present. In an echo of the end of the “Pilot” and the end of “All Hell Breaks Loose Part II,” Dean drops the shotgun into the truck and says, “We’ve got work to do,” shutting the trunk to take the scene to black.

The brothers arrive to start investigating and Dean remarks about “theater kids.” Sam reminds him – and us – that he was in a production of Our Town – see season one’s episode “Shadow.” We get some classic banter between the brothers as Sam points out that he also did Oklahoma! and Hugh Jackman was cast from that play. Dean responds, “You ran tech, Wolverine!”

The brothers enter the theater to be immediately confronted with Bobby and Cas and their lives set to music – the camera tilts to mimic how off kilter this seems to them. Marie and Maeve (Joy Regullano), her stage manager, immediately think they are with the publishers. Dean objects to the music, insisting it should be classic rock – just as Kripke insisted it had to be classic rock to the networks. There’s a nice flub of “Andrew Floyd Webber” instead of Andrew Lloyd Webber of musical fame that was actually improvised by Padalecki and Ackles.

Maeve responds that this is Marie’s interpretation of the books, and thus starts the real dialogue of the show – what is the place of fan fiction? Even amongst the cast of the play there are differences of opinion. Maggie (Natalie Sharp) who plays Sam is angry that Marie isn’t sticking strictly to canon and becomes the second victim when she threatens to have the play shut down.  I loved that her choice of play would have been The Outsiders – a nice nod to SE Hinton, who is a super-fan of the show, visits set every season, and has even been in several episodes. Dean – like Ackles has expressed – is also a firm supporter of canon. We’ve already seen this in season four’s “The Monster at the End of the Book,” which introduced the books in the first place. However, we see Dean grow during the course of the episode. He tells Marie, “This has been educational, seeing the story from your perspective. You keep writing, Shakespeare.” He accepts and validates her. Marie pushes, “Even if it doesn’t match how you see it?” To which he responds, “I have my version, and you have yours.” It’s a live and let live philosophy that should be more widely embraced.

Dean’s education includes the BM. It’s hilarious when both Sam and Dean immediately think bowel movement. Marie, of course, means “boy melodrama,” while others of us likely filled in bro-moment. She explains the trope for him: “You know the scene where the boys get together and they’re driving or leaning against Baby, drinking a beer, sharing their feelings. The two of them alone, but together -- bonded, united…” And then Dean is distracted by how close the two actors are standing, asking whether Marie realizes they’re brothers. This is a direct parallel to his reaction to Wincest in “The Monster at the End of the Book.” Marie just looks at him and says, “D’uh.” But then she introduces him to “subtext” – “Reasons” - and waggles her eyebrows. Fan fiction is full of the exploration of subtext and is often at the heart of transformative works – which Marie also helpfully explains to Dean.

Dean protests that there’s no space in Supernatural when he finds the robot costume. And as an aside, Robbie Thompson, the writer of the episode, has a love for robots and his avatar on twitter is a Robocop riff. Marie explains that what she’s written is transformative fiction. Her second act picks up where the books leave off. We learn that there is space, ninjas, tentacles, and Destiel – all except space are frequent subjects of fan fiction. I loved Dean’s summation of the show between the end of season five and now:  “So Sam came back from Hell, but without his soul, and Cas brought in a bunch of Leviathans from Purgatory. They lost Bobby, and then Cas and Dean got stuck in Purgatory, Sam hit a dog. Uh, they met a prophet named Kevin, they lost him too. Then Sam underwent a series of trials, in an attempt to close the Gates of Hell, which nearly cost him his life. And Dean, he became a demon, a Knight of Hell actually.” To which Marie responds by laughing and saying it’s the worst fan fiction she’s ever heard – a complaint some disgruntled viewers have made about the show. She then does what any self-respecting fan fic writer would do, she offers to hook him up with some good fic links!

At this point, the two stumble upon Kirsten (Nina Winkler) who plays Cas and Siobhan hugging. Dean asks what’s going on there. Marie says they’re hugging and goes on to explain that they’re a couple in real life. Dean doesn’t bat an eye at that but he does ask if it’s in the show. Marie says there is Destiel in Act Two – you can’t have subtext without S-E-X! To which Dean says, “What?” and looks at the camera. It’s a deliberate breaking of the fourth wall to look directly at the camera, and I’m not sure it works here.

We next cut to Sam and Dean discussing how Destiel should be pronounced. Sam clearly has no problem with the concept and even muses about pairings of Sam and Castiel. Dean is uncomfortable, especially when Sam makes it absolutely obvious with Cas/Dean – in case there were any viewers who still hadn’t gotten it. Of course, they are brothers, and Sam delights in tormenting Dean when the opportunity arises. Dean tells Sam he does not want to discuss it – and Ackles has been clear about not wanting to discuss it either. I’m not convinced that this scene will help to improve relations between fans and between fans and writers. But that doesn’t mean that Dean’s final words that accept alternative versions in addition to canon are less valid. Not wanting to discuss it, isn’t a condemnation – at least not for me. I think even more telling is Dean’s pep talk before the curtain goes up: “This is Marie’s version. I want you to stand as close as she wants you to. I want you to put as much SUB in to that text as you possibly can.” If that isn’t a ringing endorsement of go forth and write YOUR story, I don’t know what is.

The episode is simply full of nods to the 200 episodes and the writers don’t spare themselves from the odd criticism either. When the entire cast is gathered before curtain, Sam asks where Chuck is – you can see that Crowley, Jody Mills, Jo, Ellen, and Ash are all there now – and the Robot. I loved Marie’s comment that “the whole author inserting himself into the narrative, it’s not my favorite. I kind of hate the meta stories” and Sam and Dean agree! But I still maintain that the Robot is Robbie Thompson, so…. irony! Dean also quotes from Rent (which was adapted for film by a friend of Thompson’s). Maeve is worried about them getting in trouble for using lines from Rent without permission. This is a nice nod to fan fiction writers concern over copyright violation – it’s a generally accepted exception as transformative works in the US (and I could write another 3000 words on the topic). The speech ends with a shout out to the great Kim Manners when Dean tells the cast to “kick it in the ass” – Manners famous line at the beginning of a take. And did anyone notice Dean trying to straighten “Cas’s” always twisted tie - as "Sammy" fusses with "Dean's" samulet?

Manners, who directed so many of the episodes and was an executive producer until his death in season four, is also referenced through the X-Files references as that was his first claim to fame. It’s hilarious that Marie and Maeve refuse to believe that Sam and Dean are Sam and Dean but do believe they could be from the X-Files. Of course, “I believe” was the tag from The X-Files. They tell them they’re too old to be the brothers – though maybe Bobby and Rufus! Nice shout out to Rufus. We also have references to “Hellhouse” and the tulpa when they think that may be the monster, and of course, it’s inhabiting a version of one of the first really scary monsters on Supernatural – the scarecrow. I thought Marie’s scarecrow looked a lot more like the suicidal teddy bear from “Wishful Thinking” though. We get another Ghostfacer reference when they do the Ghostfacer salute to end the pre-show huddle. There is also a Harvelle’s Roadhouse set. We see a wendigo in the wings during the performance too. One of the cast members laments that she’d wanted to do Wicked. Dean remarks that that would have been easier – witches are easier to kill! But it’s also a reference to “Slumber Party” the Supernatural homage to The Wizard of Oz.

Once Maggie is taken, Marie, as her understudy has to take over the part of Sam for the performance. We learn that she is a “Samgirl” – she tells Dean, “if Sam and Dean were real, they would’t back down from a fight, especially my sweet, selfless Sam…” Maeve, however, would appear to be Deangirl as she says to Sam, “If you cut your hair a little, you’d make a pretty good Dean.” Of course, this is also a nod to the fact that before Supernatural, Padalecki played Dean (a different character) on Gilmore Girls – with a much shorter haircut. In fact, the hair references alone are hilarious in the episode. The girl playing Dean is a brunette in a blond wig – blonder than Ackles currently is and there has always been much discussion over exactly what color his hair is in fan fiction. The girl playing Sam is blond and wears a brunette wig – and of course, Marie dons a wig to play Sam. Padalecki’s luxurious hair has been the subject of much discussion, memes, and jokes about wigs. Perhaps the best mirroring in the show occurs at the end when Sam stabs Calliope at the exact moment that Marie as Sam yells, “No chick-flick moments” and stabs the scarecrow. It’s also funny that in the play “Sam” is actually shorter than “Dean” once Marie has to step in.

The original songs for the show are terrific and a big shout out to Jay Gruska and Christopher Lennertz. We begin with “The Road So Far” – to which we see Dean bopping his head backstage but there’s also “A Single Man Tear” as homage to Dean’s one perfect man tear that symbolizes his inner turmoil – a phrase coined by Sera Gamble (showrunner seasons 6 and 7). It plays during a scene from “Crossroad Blues” when Dean was in turmoil and pain over his father selling his soul so Dean could live. “I’ll Just Wait Here Then” is from an exchange in “The End” which symbolizes Castiel’s devotion to both Dean and his mission to protect him. The irony is that Nina Winkler is a soprano and Misha Collins actually damaged his vocal chords because of how much he dropped his voice for the character.

        The final song is the one that fans wait for to close out every season of the show: Carry On My Wayward son. It does not disappoint. “Mary” starts it and she is then joined by the Winchester “family” – John, surrogate father Bobby, Sam and Dean AND Adam! Fandom has long lamented that the brothers and the writers have forgotten about John’s other son Adam who also died in preventing the Apocalypse. Sam doesn’t even realize who it is until Maeve reminds him that he’s still locked in the cage with Lucifer. Ackles and Padalecki both have wonderful reaction shots to the cast singing the song. Dean is clearly moved and Sam smiles fondly.

And finally, there’s the Samulet. Marie tells Dean he should have never thrown it away. Dean responds that “It never really worked. I don’t need a symbol to remind me how I feel about my brother.” She then tells him to take it and calls him a “jerk” to which Dean, of course, automatically responds, “bitch!” He’s immediately horrified to realize he’s said that to a woman! Marie takes pity on him and laughs to break the tension, but we still get the Dean/Sam Bitch/Jerk moment! Dean’s statement is reinforced as we see how far Dean has come. He shushes Sam as they watch the final BM moment of the play. This is beautifully shot as “Dean” and “Sam” in the “Impala” are perfect mirror images to Dean and Sam watching backstage. “Sam” says “We need to be back on the road doing what we do best – saving people, hunting things” – it’s the show’s tagline. Sam agrees when “Dean” says “the two of us on the road together.”

The final scene of the brothers is of them in the Impala and Dean wordlessly hangs the prop samulet from the rearview mirror. The brothers have only to exchange a look for us to know that they are now in complete harmony – possibly for the first time in almost five years! Was anyone really hoping that Sam would then pull out the real samulet and hang it beside the other one on the rearview mirror?

The basic monster of the week story was a bit thin, but as a 200th episode? This episode was fantastically satisfying. I think the entire guest cast did a fantastic job. And hey, anybody else realize that this in the only episode where nobody other than the monster was killed? Even in “What Is and What Should Never Be” there were corpses hanging in the Djinn’s lair even if they didn’t technically die in the episode… What did you think of the episode? Was there enough love for fans? Was it too much love for the “in crowd”? What was your favorite song? Let me know your thoughts in the comments below!

About the Author - Lisa Macklem
I do interviews and write articles for the site in addition to reviewing a number of shows, including Supernatural, Arrow, Agents of Shield, The Walking Dead, Game of Thrones, Forever, Defiance, Bitten, Glee, and a few others! Highlights of this past year include covering San Diego Comic Con as press and a set visit to Bitten. When I'm not writing about television shows, I'm often writing about entertainment and media law in my capacity as a legal scholar. I also work in theatre when the opportunity arises. I'm an avid runner and rider, currently training in dressage.

70 comments:

  1. I haven't watched Supernatural since the Season 7 finale but I really want to watch this episode. Do you think I could just watch it and not have to catch up with Season 8, 9 and 10 so far?

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  2. I was not 100 % sure but i was guessing Chuck is GOD. I wonder if they will do anything else with him this season.

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  3. You can watch it maybe without being lost but u should watch season 8 and 9. Dean tells the writer of the play what went down after season 5 in few words.

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  4. Yes you probably could, there isnt really anything in the episode that you would need to have seen the last 4/5 seasons to understand. Its pretty much all references to Destiel and one liners from Dean.

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  5. I'll catch up one day, I have Seasons 8 and 9 on Blu-ray, it's just getting around to watching them :)

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  6. The monster of the week plot was a little thin, but it became more substanitive when Chuck was revealed to be the publisher. Marie was right to question if Calliope was there for her or the publisher. You just know Chuck was what drew Calliope in and not a high school play.

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  7. i've missed a bunch of episodes, and i came to realize while on vacation that i'm over the show and i guess conventions, but conventions are the only place i will get to see the people i have made friends with so we'll see how it all goes. and we'll see if i still watch religiously.

    i thought the episode itself was a bit weak, but it did pay homage to what has kept the show alive for 10 seasons, so i guess that's great. i dunno. 200 episodes i would rather expect something amazing like the musical episode of Buffy, than something that is like a 'Thank you' to the fans. I guess it was nice that they do go through all the nostalgia of all they have been through and get back to being close to the original Sam and Dean like in the first couple season.

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  8. As much as I love this show, I couldn't help but cringe through this entire nightmare load of meta-crap episode. The musical members were cleaver but still so cringeworthy I had to mute them. If it wasn't for the musical parts to the episode I think I would've enjoyed it a lot more than I did. Some of the references were very funny and touching to reminisce over. I think my favorite part was the ending & finally seeing Chuck make another appearance, but especially that the episode was over! was very touching to see Chuck (aka God) finally make another appearance & at least the monster part was a letter cleaver if not predictable. Overall, making it to 200 episodes is quite an achievement even if I hated the episode itself!

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  9. I loved every moment of this episode and barely can find anything at all the complain about. Personally this "meta" episode was the perfect way to handle a 200 episode celebration. It delivered lots of laughs, a lot of tear-jerking moments and left me smiling long into the night. 10/10 from me.

    Also so glad that the four original songs are going to be released onto iTunes. They should be up at any time. :)

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  10. Yep. You definitely don't need to know anything. Dean will catch you up. In fact, this might be just the refresher you need to watch the last 3 seasons....

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  11. They've confirmed several times that Chuck was God - in interviews and what not. However, Chuck may have been acting as a vessel for God, so it's possible he's no longer God... regardless, I want him back!

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  12. Maybe. But is Chuck the "real" author or was he just acting as Prophet for God - and then potentially a vessel for God?

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  13. I think it's important to remember that we didn't have Whedon - or Kripke - writing it. I was really, really hoping Kripke might do it... but alas... So definitely much better than I'd been expecting - and really, the fan service was magnificent.


    And fyi? You can still visit those friends even if you don't go to conventions... ;)

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  14. I'm definitely expecting this episode to garner a lot of pretty strong reactions - both negative and positive. I liked the musical numbers more for the episodes they managed to reference.

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  15. I think releasing the songs is pretty cool! I did think this was a clever way to look back at the episodes and hit on things that the fans have asked about.

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  16. I loved the episode at first, and thought it would put to rest the shipping and canon nonsense and for all. The show is the show, fanfiction is fanficiton. The writers have their version, fans can have their own.


    But no. The D/C shippers are in full effect, saying up and down that Destiel will be canon. So I'm dreading the next year of people screaming "subtext" and the the writers are homophobes and queerbaiters.

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  17. I already said this on the what did you think section, but I thought of posting it here too, but first, great review! It notices that you put a lot of work into it, so kudos!


    Now onto my comment: it must have been like 3 years since I last watched SPN. I dropped it midways of S7 and have not watched ever since, but last night I made an exception for the 200th episode.

    There was so much nostalgia! The monster of the week aspect was lame, but I always appreciate when the show goes meta; even though I hate S6 as a whole, "The French Mistake" is still on my top 10 SPN episodes list.
    "Fan Fiction" got me to remember how much I missed the show and the rendition of "Carry on my wayward son" got me very emotional, to the point I even considered going back into the show.

    I still don't know if I actually could go through the second half of S7 and watch 8, 9 and 10; I still think the show should have ended in S5 and that is becoming harder and harder to envision an ending to series that could be as satisfying as "Swan Song", and also I don't know if the storylines can be as entertaining and deeply emotional as they were before considering the Winchesters are pretty much guaranteed to defeat every single foe that goes against them, sooner or later, which takes away an important aspect of the show: the high stakes. Also the more the show goes on, the more it forbids these two characters to eventually have the normal life they crave for deeply inside: season 5 ended on the note that Dean could finally reach it, but then it had to be discarded so that the show could go on, and that makes it very sad to watch for me, because the more they go on, the more I realize there is no endgame, and that when it comes it may not be able to reach the heights of "Swan Song"


    That being said, I do miss the joy SPN brought me over the years, and maybe the newer seasons could still be enjoyable, but I don't know if I can actually get back into it for the reasons stated above. I dearly miss my weekly dosis of Sam and Dean solving cases and killing monsters, but without a clear endgame is hard for me to return.

    Anyway, very good episode; really enjoyable

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  18. I'm the same way, and I watched it; I didn't need to know anything beyond season 5, it was all pretty self explainatory. And it was a good episode, with lots of nostalgia going for it

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  19. As Dean might say, that was friggin' awesome! LOVED every minute of it--and yes, I have hopes Sam someday replaces the prop samulet with the real one--because he may well have taken it out of the trash can. The "breaking the fourth wall" look at the camera was improvised by Ackles. And I thought the lyrics to A Single Man Tear were quite moving. Loved the shout-out to Carry On Wayward Son when Sam says "Really?" and Dean and the director both pointedly say: "It's a CLASSIC!" And lovely as done by the cast at the end. I laughed, I cried, I applauded.

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  20. Seasons 8 and 9 got the show back on track. There are always some clunkers, but most are really good episodes with a great arc. The S9 finale blew the doors off in the last few minutes. (NO SPOILERS.) You should check them out.

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  21. Thanks! And I totally understand your feelings. I have to admit that the part of me that really loved SPN and got so excited for it to air every week has slowly faded. I really do think of the "show" now as just those first five seasons. What's come since is still entertaining, but it's never reached the same level for me. Last season had some very good individual episodes but the overall pacing for the season was uneven for me. I think if you've got the distance now, you might be able to come back and enjoy the show in a different way. I for one did not like the season nine finale, but I've really had to reassess that based on the beginning of this season which really has been exceptionally good. Dean pretty much caught you up on what's happened now, so maybe consider jumping back in - however, I don't see any clear end game...

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  22. Yep. I knew Jensen had improvised that. And we all know that Sam listens to emo-crap...

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  23. Well, you do a good job her eof making a silk purse out of a sow's ear, but this has to go down as one of the worst episodes of this show to date. Even laying aside the meta stuff, whihc for me just came across as pandering and awkward . . . Calliope, the muse of epic poetry, as a Monster of the week who inspires and then eats writers? REALLY????? This has to be the dumbest idea they've come up with so far.

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  24. I am involved in the fandom - I used to discuss the show all the time and I still am working on a fanfic right now, though I don't have time much for it anymore (nor the drive with my dropping passion for this show after the last couple seasons).


    I don't care for Meta. I don't need nods to me or any other part of the fandom. You can have fun, but Agents of Shield is a great example of having fun stuff without over doing it [for me], not this. Supernatural's comedy episodes, especially when high on Meta, are too over the top for me.


    I did not like most of "The French Mistake" and I did not like much of this episode either. Meta makes me cringe. So most of the scenes I liked were typical episode feeling stuff like Dean working on the Impala, "We've got work to do", and the riding off in the Impala.


    I did like the "Carry On Wayward Son" song because the girls had beautiful voices. Especially the one playing Mary. And Dean & Sam during that scene.


    I also liked the mention of Adam and Dean and Sam's reactions. Please Carver say that means you plan to get Adam out of Hell! Make him go anywhere else. It doesn't even have to be onscreen.


    Chuck was a nice surprise. I don't like the Supernatural books, hated Becky with a passion (the kind of crazy girl I get imagines in my head of sending via rushed shipping someplace far away to never be seen again), but Chuck I like. The "I am the prophet Chuck" quote and his scenes in "The End" sold me.


    Anyway that sums up my liked scenes. I didn't care for the other songs (too high school musical for me). I also thought the Goddess talked was weird. I forgot the exact quote, but when she was explaining why the play was great it reminded me of the way teens talk in the movies (not even like 90%-100% of real people). This is a centuries old being show!

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  25. That's interesting. I'd read them hinting at it but never confirming it. You're the first person to tell me they confirmed it.

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  26. I definitely agree with most of what you say here. My least favorite episode in season one isn't Bugs - it's Hellhouse because, like you, I want to immerse myself in this world and those episodes tend to take me out of it - as I said in my review. I've come to terms with it essentially by considering the highly meta episodes and the highly comedic ones as separate entities - almost like a different show - certainly like an AU fan fic! I think you hit the nail on the head by describing the songs as too high school musical - I haven't seen that, but I think it describes the songs perfectly. And the show, unfortunately, has rarely done ancient gods terribly well - at least in recent seasons where they are often simply a joke...

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  27. Honestly, it wouldn't matter what the show said...

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  28. That's true. They are so focused on making minute details into deep subtext, that the actually text tends to fly over there heads.


    Plus, I literally just saw some wank about the scene where Anna visits Dean while he's dreaming about strippers making out, which claimed there was Destiel subtext in it. So it really is futile.

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  29. Rob Benedict has shared the story many, many times at conventions. Kripke confirmed it on the phone with him.

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  30. Subtext is a double edged sword. Literary theory will support any theory you can squeeze out of a text based on pretty thin evidence. However, it doesn't negate the validity of _any_ interpretation - including the authors! That's the point of Dean's speech. You can have your own version - but it won't be the writers' version - and that's ok. Personally, I miss them giving us little presents to add to the subtext, and I think that's the result of the really aggressive pushing for more.

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  31. I liked it -- agree with all you said Lisa. I get the issues everybody had with it, but sometimes, a nice easy show is okay with me. And they delivered some comfort food TV and I appreciated it.

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  32. I personally loved it, the best episode in seasons. I mean nothing particullary plot-wise happened, but it was refreshing to get an episode that felt like the old supernatural to me. The musical numbers were brilliant and quite well done. My favourite was "the road so far" as it had the best beat in my opinion. The cover of "Carry On My Wayward Son" was also fantastic. The monster of the week was weak and ultimately another poorly done pagan god. However it was done like any other pagan god stories have been so I am happy with it. I really do want to know what happened to Kali though. Also would love to see Thor at some point, even if Zeus was a huge disappointment. The brotherly bond is back in full swing which is fun and surprising, hopefully it will at least last this year. In conclusion, I believe that it was a great letter to the fans and they did a great fun episode that everyone could be happy with. Bringing back Chuck was brilliant although confusing how they are going to use him if they will in the future.

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  33. I gotta disagree with you there. Season 7 had two incredible episodes, then went a little wonky. There was just too much going on... But 8 and 9 were like an entirely different show. I used to watch every episode again and again, but there are only a handful of episodes in season 8 and 9 that I have watched more than once. It is now just a good show that I watch with some of my favorite TV actors. This episode felt more like Supernatural, but after Carver had Sam not look for Dean and abandon Kevin, it just doesn't feel like the same show...

    How can the same character not look for his brother when he just disappears, but go ballistic trying to find his brother when he dies, disappears, and tells him to let him go? If you think some creature is walking around in your brothers body, why would you look harder than when your brother might be in the next town over with amnesia?

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  34. Ha! I felt the same way about 8&9 - and I used to re-watch like crazy. During the hiatus between 2 and 3 I rewatched the finale every day. Between 9 and 10? I didn't watch a single episode from any season. And I thought there were some really great stand alones last season. This season, so far, has seemed better...

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  35. Thanks - and comfort food is a great way to describe it!

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  36. Calliope is actually a Greek goddess, but I agree, while weak, she was at least consistent with the way they've treated the others. I'm hoping that Chuck is just Chuck now - though if they wanted to make him a Prophet again, I'd be ok with that too! If he's no longer a prophet though, he could just be writing... But maybe others would go after him for information on the Winchesters? I don't care how they do it, I'd just love to see more Chuck!

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  37. The non musical parts were ok but the musical except for Carry on were complete dreck. I also wish if writers are going to write fans in they wouldn't make the fans look like complete idiots. More of a slap in the face then a love letter. As for Chuck no he wasn't god. The actor believes he was god but that doesn't mean he is. It's just as easy he's a Trickster or some other MOTW. Chuck is ok but the ones topping the list are John (JDM, not Cohen), Bobby, Ellen, Jody and Benny are in the top 5 most of the time. I thought Changing Channels, French Mistake silly but I'd watch them again. When TNT airs this ep next year I'll be watching another channel instead of my usual SN daily trio of eps.

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  38. KRIPKE told Rob Benedict he was God. So, yes. He was. In fact, when Rob arrived on set, he didn't realize it until the crew started asking him how he felt about being God, then Kripke confirmed it via phone call. There are tons of videos on youtube of Rob telling the story. As for who we'd like to see back, that's going to be different for everyone...

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  39. As I said Kripke isn't in charge of Supernatural anymore. Kripke could tell him he's the tooth fairy doesn't mean a thing since Carver gets to chose which stories go to script and which scripts get filmed and if Carver doesn't like him being God then he's not. It has been alluded to but it's never been said on screen so Chuck could be anyone. Chuck being god is not canon.

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  40. Kripke was showrunner AND wrote Swan Song. Chuck may become something else now - God may have been using him as a vessel - but that doesn't change the fact that Chuck WAS god.

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  41. I love how it was set in an all girl school given that there has been critisism that there aren't enough females in the show.

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  42. This next week's episode will be a Gabriel/Trickster episode? The actor was on set a couple months back presumably during the filming of episode 5 or 6: https://www.facebook.com/SpnTvShow/posts/637350993052623

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  43. He could have been on set for a number of reasons. I mean he just as well may be directing an episode and just shadowing the director.

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  44. Chuck is God, but also Kripke, because Kripke was the creator of the show and the stories told in the first five seasons. As far as Chuck goes, I thought he was included in this episode to tie the first five seasons to the show now -- the "then" and the "now."

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  45. I used to rewatch every episode and watch the season again during the summer. Not anymore. I hardly ever rewatch an episode and summers are now just a dry spell for me. I absolutely hated S7, 8 and 9.

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  46. The sad part is that these vocal few have ruined the Dean/Cas profound bond, and that was the only reason I liked Cas. Since then, I find him and his stories without purpose in the show.
    The Destiel crap is a political movement and they are never going to turn it loose.

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  47. I thought I made that connection pretty clear when I mentioned the "Then" title card - Kripke created this world, like God created ours...

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  48. And of course fan fic writers are primarily women and if you go to a convention, you would think every fan of the show is female....

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  49. He and Rob are good friends and this was all around the time of the big fan convention in Vancouver. He may have just been visiting. But fingers crossed!

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  50. Nice to see we agree about the central message. Much has been made about Jensen's look at the camera. Unfortunately, those who want their version as canon have taken a great deal of offence to that shot. I agree with your assessment, but then, I've been saying that's what the writers have said all along - and I totally get that. Most fan fic writers/readers are completely ok with everyone having their own take on the show, so why is it so hard to accept the source material with the same respect? What's that saying about if wishes were horses, we'd all be television writers? I also completely agree that a HUGE part of the success of seasons 1-5 was Kim Manners. I honestly credit him with the vision as much as Kripke.


    I also don't feel like I look forward to _any_ of the writers now. I used to look forward to Carver's episodes (under Kripke), Edlund, Kripke, Tucker, even Gamble (under Kripke!) but not any more. Carver has not maintained a decent story arc yet. Too much shoved into the first handful of episodes then pointless one offs, some good episodes in the middle of the season, then a fallow period and then no real payoff in the last few episodes. Any good story elements have just felt squandered. So, I've started every season with high hopes, only to end the season wondering if I would keep watching.


    Latest news is that Carver has a new show to run next season. Will he do two at once? Unlikely. Will SPN be announced as in it's last season? I'm absolutely sure that we will get a "last" season. Would it matter if they could get Kripke to come back? I'm not sure even he could salvage it at this point, but omg - what are the alternatives? Glass? Thompson? Eek!

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  51. Totally agreed.

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  52. I thought the epi was interesting. I am not a fan of shows that do
    musicals....its kinda just never good. I thought the singing was
    stellar....but the overall storyline did not fit with a musical genre.



    I did like how the show was poking fun at itself. I read the gripe review....and I felt that perhaps the analysis was a bit harsh....I thought the epi was a way to pay homage to the different ways of being a fan of the show. I often find for any show, that the FanFiction writers that keep a certain ship going, are really under appreciated. I loved that the show showed them some love for all that they do in keeping the show alive.



    I think that this was a show that just paid homage to all segments of fans, and was not meant to be taken seriously. What I did like was that the epi reminded Sam and Dean how great they are as brothers.

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  53. Totally disagree with your analysis on Literary theory.

    Metatheoretical constructs provides the lens for which you can view a particular piece - text. It helps to develop the frame so that you can build the house....so to speak. It is the analysis which is often times the issue, not the theoretical praxis. Folks tend to deviate .... mix and blend theories....this is not always done in a kosher way.

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  54. Its sooo true...never thought of this....but how else could they have shown what took place in 200 episodes in one hour.....tough job for them.

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  55. I don't see that you are disagreeing with me here. Are you saying that you can only use one theory on any text? And I don't see your connection to the law at all. The law is predicated on the existence of multiple arguments.

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  56. Have to agree that I was dreading them doing a musical episode, so I was pleasantly surprised. A musical is such a different genre that it takes me right out of the show. In getting more and more out there with the meta, I think the show is starting to overdo it - which again takes me out of the show itself, but as a 200th kind of retrospective, I did like it. I liked what they had to say about (to) the fans - but I don't have high expectations that all the fans will take it in the spirit that it was meant.

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  57. "Literary theory will support any theory you can squeeze out of a text based on pretty thin evidence."

    I disagree with this statement. As I stated the theory is not the problem it is the analysis. Literary theory is a broaaaaad brush to use....so yeah, I disagree with your application of it in this sentence.

    ....one can use more then one theory on any text....For instance - I would define myself as a Black Post-Modern Feminist....arguably a mix or blend of three different theoretical constructs or lens.

    The analyst constructs the lens, either coming at it from a pure base, or mixing and blending theories - framing.

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  58. Perhaps it's my phrasing - my point is that you can use theory to justify saying numerous things about any text. Perhaps you have been spared the amount of poorly supported literary theory arguments that I've had to wade through - and poorly argued legal cases. Literary theory IS a broad brush - I think you are a case in point ;)

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  59. Omg no worries. It is good to talk about these things....above all else I am a scholar. :)

    I know it all seems sooo nuanced, but in fact it is quite jam packed with meaning. As theory does not justify what takes place in the text or what one can say about the text, all it can do is provide a lens with which to view/read the text through....the analyst constructs the lens, based on either one or many theories -- often times charting new territory of analysis - very few times does said theory change (like never - unless you are a Foucault, Irigaray, Friedan...etc)....

    It seems nuanced but it is quite an important distinction.

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  60. I hear ya. Like I had said I got caught up in another thread on this site....and was blown away by the angst.....I am glad that there is like a pro con version for threads.

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  61. The sad part is that theory is most often so divorced from reality or tortured by "scholars" that it loses all sense or impact. I wish I had a dime for every essay that I've marked and scholarly paper I've attended at academic conferences that did so...

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  62. You are right, theory is not meant to be or explain real life....how could it...so much of it is fantastical in its extreme, even when applied to reality....

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  63. yes she is, Greek Gods can be considered Pagan Gods, strange but true. I personally would of preferred the whole thing be a creation of Gabriel and leave Chucks' intro for something a little more exciting or relevant to the mythology of the season.

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  64. While they can be considered pagan, they are a separate classification. All the Greek goddesses they've done have worn the same Greek-inspired clothing and hair. Though the motif of killing them with wood _does_ extend to the other pagan gods - as in the Christmas episode....


    I don't think they even needed Gabriel to explain it - the high school musical did it for me. I strongly suspect that Chuck was just there as a wink and a nod directly from the writers that they think the fan fiction is pretty good.

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  65. you know I got too see it again and I really liked it the songs was not that bad I cringe I little but they was good the 2nd time around and the end god it did make me Cry too hear that song singed that was it was great.

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  66. we do not even know what Sam Listens too anymore.

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  67. It's not what I would have expected out of a landmark episode like this but it was certainly what I needed. In hindsight, I feel like it was almost perfect. The show has been around long enough for the fans to sort of sit back and take a nostalgic, hilarious, and surprisngly touching lookback at the history of the show--good and bad. I liked that instead of going for large number of cameos, they went in the completely opposite direction and only and Sam and Dean. I could easily imagine a version where they worked in the real actors portray the characters and sing the songs, but then it would have been about getting everyone together for the episode and there are so many people it's a guarantee that you can't get everyone you want and it would be disappointing. It was about characters ultimately, and I felt every major character and landmark was represented. Also, in the context of this season, I feel like at this point, they really needed that episode to get the show back on track because I am not at all happy with how they have handled it since the beginning of the season with the whole Deanmon storyline. Not to mention the Cass storyline so far has been a big fat bore; they have taken away from Castiel everything that made him unique and interesting. This episode was like a mini-reboot emotionally for the brothers who at the end were reminded of what was important for them in their lives and what their purpose was: saving people, hunting things.

    P.S. When the kids did their version of Carry On Wayward Son in the end, I almost teared up. More than how it was performed, it was just that song. It was an episode that got us thinking about the history of the show and that song has been the one constant throughout the show. For me, that song will forever be inextricably linked to the show, so it was perfect listening to it at the end.

    P.P.S. I am thankful that I was not made to sit through the space ninja alien version. That would have been horrible.

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  68. Also, and maybe I am reading too much into it, but I felt like the school-play version of Supernatural was a metaphor for the show since Kripke left. I have always said that the show since he left is like good fan fiction and I would love to watch it for as long as they made it, but it's not the original show. They sort of deal with that a little bit when Dean tells her what happened since what she thinks is the end of the story and she responds by calling it bad fan fiction. I would not call it bad necessarily, but yeah it really does feel like fan fiction at times.


    The show has been around for long enough that no new viewer ever dares to take it up to watch from the beginning anymore but whenever any friend enquires about that show to me, my response is, it's not everybody, but it's a great show and if you watch the first five seasons (leaving out the part at the end of the finale where Sam comes back), you get a full story with a beginning middle and end, and a really well crafted mythology too. But after season 5 finale, it's really only for the fans.

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