We're trialling another new Live Discussion post today and Sleepy Hollow has been selected as our next show to do a Live Discussion.
This means that you're free to discuss the show as it airs in the comments and then you can vote on the Poll when it's over. This post is opened 15 Minutes before the episode airs on the East Coast. It goes without saying, unless you're watching it live and don't want to be spoiled, don't proceed any further :)
Hopefully you'll enjoy being able to comment on the show live as it airs. We've also embedded a special Live Twitter Widget below using the hashtag #STVSH so you can follow along on twitter if you wish as well.
So let us know what you think during the episode and what you think of being able to comment on the show whilst it airs in the comments below.
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ReplyDeleteSo what are your hopes and fears for tonight's episode? I do not want Katrina to die but I am excited about her being with the rest of the team.
Grumpy Ichabod makes a great point. If you don't bother to vote, you can't complain about the results.
ReplyDeleteKatrina and Ichabod reuinted again. Here's hoping it is for more than 1 episode.
ReplyDeleteSo what do you think of the episode so far? I like how we jumped right into the action. I would feel sorry for Abraham if he wasn't serving Moloch. I think this is going to be the episode that forces a break between Abraham and Henry. I can't wait to see the two horsemen going against each other.
ReplyDeleteHellfire Club back again. Good continuity.
ReplyDeleteScore one for that prediction. Now let's get Moloch out of Katrina. Now. How exactly do you explain that your mom delivered your boss?
ReplyDeleteIt's a flaming note. Did they just get accepted by hell's version of Hogwarts?
ReplyDeleteLove this lie to get New Sheriff on board.
ReplyDeleteLet's arrivein the nick of time folks. No time to chat New Sheriff.
ReplyDeleteWoo hoo. Katrina's still alive. I am happy even if a lot of people are not.
ReplyDeleteI wish we could have learned more about Katrina. And when did Abbie teach Ichabod CPR? I'd like to know these things.
ReplyDeleteAnd Katrina and Ichabod need to stop thinking Jeremy can be saved. It's too late for him. I understand they're his parents but he's far too gone.
Henry's hate for Katrina gives me so much pleasure.
ReplyDeleteIchabod learned CPR from Hawley when he saved Abbie in the library. I haven't given up on Henry yet either. He would make for one heck of a redemption story.
ReplyDeleteI like Katrina. I think she has one of the best backstories of anyone. I wish we got to know more about her in this episode.
ReplyDeleteAm I supposed to be rooting for Ichabod and Katrina? Should I be siding with these idiots and their dumbass drama? I really think the show wants me to but all I want is for Abbie to bitch slap both Katrina and Ichabod and tell them to GTFO...the world is more important than your stupid love and evil son.
ReplyDeleteUrgh this episode was really irritating. I don't really know how much more of this I can take...might have to start skipping episodes or something. I'm just really not enjoying this season.
I'm happy, too. They actually had me briefly worried there for a moment, though.
ReplyDeleteSo many good character scenes tonight. I LOVED the one with Abbie's pep talk to Katrina and her reassurance that they'd find another way to save her, just as Katrina had found another way to save Ichabod. That was really, really sweet. And I love the clever way they managed to get Katrina into modern clothes-Abbie's "Don't think we have time for a shopping spree" line was good.
Ichabod and Henry's face off at the institution was excellent, too. Damn good actors, those guys. And I loved the sweeter moments between Ichabod and Katrina as well-her speech to him about "230 years", and the emotion he showed in his concern for her, both were so incredibly touching and lovely. I also felt so much for Katrina with this pregnancy-the moment I saw things shifting about inside her stomach at the start I was like, "...yep, that's not good." I see from the live discussion above that there's a bunch of hate for her on Twitter, and to that I just roll my eyes. Get over it already, people, for god's sake.
In lighter moments, the voting discussion between Ichabod and Abbie was good (I liked her line about paying his bills. Hee), and their fist bump at the end was cute, too, especially with the way Ichabod capped it off. Look at him getting into the modern swing of things :D! And I loved the password thing during their search of the building, too-666. Nice.
Also a creative way to let Reyes in on what's up in town. I'm all for her becoming an ally of the duo. This was an exciting episode, I quite enjoyed it. Now I'm even more scared about what the hell Henry will try and do next, if he's that devoted to Moloch.
Ichabod probably just remembered the CPR from that episode a couple weeks ago where it had to be used on Abbie to save her after her near-death encounter with the Weeping Lady.
ReplyDeleteI was worried that they were going to capitulate to the vocal part of the fandom that wants Katrina dead so Abbie and Ichabod can get together. I am very happy that they didn't. I actually would love to see Katrina stay with the team and possibly become friends with Jenny. I think they could make a powerful duo. I too liked Abbie pep talk to Katrina, just like I loved when they did the spell together to stop the Weeping Lady. In fact, I am a little miffed that they seem to want Abbie and Katrina at odds instead of celebrating how amazing their strengths combined could be. I get sick of females fighting (usually over a man) on TV when they could show powerful friendships instead. It kind of reminds me of how they had Abbie and Jenny at odds in the beginning, but now we know they are stronger together. I would love to have a trio of kick butt ladies taking down the baddies on this show.
ReplyDeleteI also loved hte father-son showdown. John Noble sells it every time and these two have amazing chemistry on screen. You can feel the emotion pouring off. I like that both Ichabod and Katrina want to see the possibility in their son. It's the parental thing to do, even though I totally get Abbie's frustration intheir faith. In the end, I do think Henry will be redeemed but he will probably die trying. I see him as the Darth Vader of this show.
As for the voting, I am with Ichabod all the way. It always depresses me how few people make the decisions for our country and yet there is always a plethora of people complaining about it. I also like Ichabod's response to Abbie knowing it was 666. That's what i was guessing too but he seemed very disappointed in them. I also agree that New Sheriff getting somewhat onboard is a good thing. We already went down the doubt road and it was jsut frustrating. Time to move past that.
It was a good episode but Katrina and Ichabod need to stop having faith that their son can be saved I get it that you don't want to turn your back on your child but sometimes you have to for them to learn their lesson
ReplyDeleteI am rooting for Ichabod and Katrina, but mostly I am rooting for all the people on Team Stop the Apocalypse. I was more frustrated with Abbie insinuating that Katrina slept with Abraham because it sounded like she was a jealous shrew trying to cause trouble and that is not who Abbie is. I hope that Abbie and Katrina get many opportunities to work together and see each other's strengths for the remainder of the season.
ReplyDeleteI actually thought that Ichabod remembering the CPR was good continuity on the show's part as was the Hellfire Club. I too think there is more to Henry than we know. I can't think that he is a mindless slave to Moloch because that shortchanges John Noble, who is far too good of an actor to waste on a character that would be that flat.
ReplyDeleteI was worried that they were going to capitulate to the vocal part of the fandom that wants Katrina dead so Abbie and Ichabod can get together. I am very happy that they didn't.
ReplyDeleteAmen to that. And yes to Katrina and Jenny becoming friends. I'd be all for that, too.
In fact, I am a little miffed that they seem to want Abbie and Katrina at odds instead of celebrating how amazing their strengths combined could be. I get sick of females fighting (usually over a man) on TV when they could show powerful friendships instead. It kind of reminds me of how they had Abbie and Jenny at odds in the beginning, but now we know they are stronger together. I would love to have a trio of kick butt ladies taking down the baddies on this show.
THIS. So, so much this. I feel like some of the fandom actually wants that to happen or gets excited at that prospect and I do not get why. We've got more than enough jealousy and catfighting among women on TV, we don't need more of it. Abbie, Jenny, and Katrina are all smart, mature women, and they're better than that. That's not to say they won't disagree sometimes, that's not to say they shouldn't ever fight, 'cause, well, it's a tense situation, that's gonna happen sometimes. But yes to them ultimately realizing their problems are bigger than whatever personal issues they might have and working together. I am all for that and I really hope the show sticks with that route.
Noble is awesome. The biggest reason I'd hesitate for him to be redeemed is because he plays evil so well! And I don't disagree with Abbie's concerns about Ichabod and Katrina wanting to save their son, not at all. She has some excellent points, and I felt for her during the scene where she and the Cranes were debating seeing Henry, 'cause, wow, that was tense. But I can understand and sympathize with Ichabod and Katrina's sentiments, too. I just said elsewhere that this war is not going to be all black and white, and I think a lot of people would do well to keep that in mind-all sorts of loyalties are going to be tested this season, it sounds like, even that of the characters fans most love to see together.
Ichabod's rant about voting was 100% mine. And I especially loved Abbie's comment about how long it took someone like her, who is both black and a woman, to earn that right. That's the part that frustrates me the most-white men who've always had that right take it for granted, and any minorities who don't vote even after all their ancestors did to give them that right...it boggles my mind. One of the big reasons I vote is as a means of thanking all the women who worked hard to let me be able to do that. Shame there was that rule in place about no campaigning at the polls, though-I wouldn't have minded listening to Crane rant a little more about his suggestions for what Abbie should or shouldn't vote for on his behalf :p.
I always had a feeling Reyes would be on their side, and I too am glad they didn't stretch that suspicion out for too long and let her get on board.
Well that was the grossest labor I've ever seen. LOL. And I don't get grossed out, but I think mostly it had to do with that damn spider. (Shivers). This was an intense episode, and some things I liked and some things I didn't.
ReplyDeleteI always love Ichabod and Henry's scenes. Their scenes are so intense and powerful i just get lost in them. Ichabod taking a risk by touching Henry was great. But seeing Henry was a nice little twist in the vision. And I'm a little confused on what he was doing at the end? I didn't catch that.
Ichabod and Abbie scenes, welI i always love them. Loved the voting scene, and when they went to retrieve the device in the safe. "It's an evil club try 666" LOL...that was hilarious and I'm glad Abbie actualay got it right instead of Ichabod. But god that whole scene with Ichabod, Abbie and Katrina really bothered me. Katrina, I get it he's your son, you love him unconditionally, blah blah blah, but c'mon let's get real here. Ichabod changing his mind so quickly irked me, and I felt like Abbie was just backed into a corner. But I took a breath, and said okay let's see what happens, and the result I had in my mind, revealed itself AFTER "the vote" yet, Katrina was sitting there in agony, saying "don't give up" I mean wtf?? Are you going to keep saying that while you literally watch the world burn?? Smh sigh, I can't.
I also didn't like Abbie filling the sheriff in on things. I know they had to but I would've liked it if she stayed in the dark. To me, it's like they're trying to make her Irving from season. 1 By filling her in, and i didn't like that. Not if that means he has to take a back seat this season. I'm not saying that's what they're doing, but if they continue on like this, I WILL start to feel some sort of way.
Abraham trying to save Katrina from Henry and Moloch. SERIOUSLY?? That bothered me too, and seriously every time he bowed down in the sun it made me think of Metallo in Smallville. LOL you Hardcore Smallville fans know whaT I'm talking about. The Ichabod and Katrina talk scene bothered me too. But iI have to admit I cracked up! "No more secrets Ichabod....I'm pregnant." Lmao, that was classic. They have a lot to work out, I mean A LOT, and Idt Ichabod forgave her right away, and I hope some near death experience doesn't magically excuse that. I hope that in a few weeks they REALLY sit and have a talk, b/c that two minute conversation wasn't..that shouldn't have changed anything.
Ichabod performing CPR was nice, I assummed he learned it immediately after Abbie's incident. Wish they could've showed him taking classes on it though, that would've been fun. Loved the fist bump, he even did the exploding noise. Alright! Didn't mind that Jenny and Hawley, and Irving wasn't in this episode, iI wasn't in the mood for Jenny and Hawley's "secret love affair" but i'd probably prefer that over any Katrina centric episode. (Rolls eyes). Sooo ummmUmmm she's "safe" for now. Does that mean she's going to stay with them, until Henry comes for her, once again putting Abbie and Ichabod's lives in danger? Or ALL of them? Cause i'I'm not cool with that. If she's gonna stick around they need to take her to a safe house or something, Ichabod can visit her there. And iI didn't like when Ichabod said, "I shouldn't have left you with the horseman." Ummm YOU didn't do anything, she CHOSE to stay with Abraham. Also didn't like the, "We thought we lost you." I shouted what do you mean WE??? Abbie out of respect is only associated with her b/c of you. And all of her actions equals a consequence to Abbie. Uh uh Ichabod, "I" "I thought I lost you."
Agreed on the continuity. It's always nice when a show remembers that stuff and brings it back.
ReplyDeleteI can't think that he is a mindless slave to Moloch because that shortchanges John Noble, who is far too good of an actor to waste on a character that would be that flat.
Good point. Yeah, he's no pushover...either he'll rebel against Moloch (which I would be very excited to see, whether his rebellion means he'll join with the good guys OR go off on his own evil path-and I'd be especially intrigued by the latter), or he's simply pretending to follow Moloch's orders while quietly plotting his own way of doing things. There's definitely more lurking with him than meets the eye.
I didn't quite catch the jealousy in that insinuation, myself-to me, it seemed more like her simply stating an obvious possibility (heck, it wouldn't surprise me if Abbie had wondered if Abraham might've forced himself on Katrina). Ichabod, though, his reaction to that idea was definitely borne out of jealousy, and that DID surprise me a little. I know she's lied to him a lot lately and kept secrets, but still...his reaction was rather intense.
ReplyDeleteI'm sorry I just can't get on board with this. Right now Katrina and Ichabod are selfish idiots constantly choosing each other and their evil little son (who is responsible for a ton of death) over the safety of the world.
ReplyDeleteI'll give Katrina one thing, she was totally right to say killmme and stop Muloch for being born (and yeah, I know that wasn't selfish at all...I applaud her for it). The problem is the show basically wants me to believe that her selfless decision was wrong while Ichabod's continually selfish decisions are rewarded in the narrative as being right.
It was Katrina's choice to stay with Abraham, yes, but I can see why Ichabod would feel guilty and feel like he should've fought harder to get her out of there sooner. And the whole "we thought we lost you" thing-I think that's just his way of trying to reassure Katrina that they're both on her side and support her, in case Katrina felt bad about any of the tension during some of the moments between her, Ichabod, and Abbie earlier in the episode.
ReplyDeleteI have no idea where Katrina will stay for safekeeping after this. I wouldn't mind her staying with Ichabod and Abbie, myself, simply because I like the idea of Ichabod and Katrina not being separated any longer, as well as giving the Cranes a chance to really talk some stuff out and have her get more properly involved in their fight. But I can see where they might want to keep her somewhere where it'd be very tough for Henry to get to her, too. Where that would be, though, I don't know-the guy's pretty freaking powerful.
Well that was the grossest labor I've ever seen. LOL. And I don't get grossed out, but I think mostly it had to do with that damn spider. (Shivers).
Seriously. I have no desire to be pregnant anytime soon as it is (if ever), and tonight pretty much just further confirmed that for me. That was one nasty, nasty looking pregnancy. Yikes. Again, I gotta applaud the special effects department on this show.
I voted for poor because I absolutely hate the mystical pregnancy trope (I hated it on Angel, Star Trek, The X-Files, and Stargate SG-1). I was not happy to see it pop-up on this show and since it was the main plot-line in the episode (not much of anything happened other than Abbie voting - which I did like because I enjoyed Ichabod's outrage at how low the voter turn out is) I'd have to rate this as being the worst episode of the show.
ReplyDeleteWell I have to disagree on that "reassure she's on Katrina's side" statement. B/c Abbie's done a lot for Katrina, A LOT! And if Katrina still needs reassurance that Abbie is "on her side" then she has issues. And when it comes to Katrina and Abbie, they need to sit down and have a talk b/c her "feeling bad" about the tension she brought on them definitely doesn't cushion the blow.
ReplyDeleteHahahaha, I too don't want children. Just watching a regular pregnacy makes me say "hell no." THIS episode made me say....FOH! Lmao
I am good with the women disagreeing as well but more for tactical reasons than the typical female catfights topics. I'd like them to assess their strengths together and then go on the offensive as a team. Teams can disagree but in the end they get things done. You cannot weaken such strong characters, among the strongest female characters on TV these days, by tossing them into petty jealousies and romantic entanglements. These characters, and the general TV audience, deserve better.
ReplyDeleteI think Abbie raised some valiud points about Henry as well. To be honest, I would have been arguing right there with her. Nothing Henry has done justifies taking that big of a risk. I also see Katrina and Ichabod's points. It's a thorny issue that will probably be raised a lot this season. I just don't want it to become another reason for people to rag on Katrina. I do think that Henry will be redeemed though because no way they have Ichabod and Katrina kill their own son and it would drive a wedge between Abbie and Ichabod so she can't so it either. I suppose Moloch could for failing him or Abraham in defense of Katrina. Either way I want to see a struggle between Jeremy and Henry, because I think John Noble would excel at it.
I am just glad that Reyes is not evil yet. I feared that she was going to be a servant of Moloch. She might still be but here's hoping.
Absolutely agree about voting. I spend a lot of time trying to teach students why it is so important in hopes that some day we will have a generation with a decent voter turnout rate. It's just irresponsible and ungrateful to not vote.
You're right that Abbie has done a lot for Katrina, and I don't mean to imply that she might not know or realize that as much as she should. Just...I could see that she felt bad watching the debate between Crane and Abbie earlier-I almost expected her after a while to go, "Okay, I don't care what we do now, let's just do something, fast!"...more like she'd feel bad for feeling like she might put any friction between them and their bond ('cause we all know she's well aware of how close of friends they are :p!). And obviously Abbie was reassuring towards her in the episode, but I think Ichabod just wanted to echo those sentiments, I guess, is what I meant to say.
ReplyDeleteOh, yeah, Katrina and Abbie do need to have a proper talk as well, no question! Now that she's out of Purgatory and out of Abraham and Henry's grasp, there is a LOT she, Ichabod, and Abbie will need to hash out.
Glad I'm not alone in the pregnancy sentiment :D! Yeah, I'm more than happy to wait a while, at the very least. A good, long while.
HahahHaha Hahahahaha. I'm sooooooo with you on your first paragraph. Never will I root for them. I root for Ichabod Alone. I root for Ichabod and Abbie. I root for all four of them. (Ichabod, Abbie, Jenny, Irving). Katrina is not in the cards for me, she'll have to earn that...hard! If she were to bit it, I'd feel very sad for Ichabod, but I would not be mourning her character.
ReplyDeleteI hope your take is right because if they take a kick butt Abbie Mills and turn her into a milsop pining over some guy, I will revolt. If they start a spat between Katrina and Abbie, I will revolt. Both women are far too good for that. I am also tired of them throwing a wedge between Ichabod and Katrina, so I hope them finally getting to spend some time together will help as well.
ReplyDeleteI think that Katrina and Ichabod mourn for their child and feel guilty even though they have nothing to feel guilty about. That causes powerful emotions and the idea that they can save their child in the end is very natural in the circumstances.
ReplyDeleteFair point about the hard choices and sacrifice, but keep in mind, just because they're showing sympathy towards Henry now doesn't mean they'll always feel that way. We're only just starting to see that sentiment show from them. We don't know how long they'll continue to think that way-they could very well decide Henry is a lost cause a few episodes down the line, too.
ReplyDeleteAnd we don't know yet what all Henry's personal motivations are-he's a very manipulative person, so he could be playing everyone, Moloch included. Or he could actually be feeling genuinely conflicted. And so on. It's so early, we don't know where this part of the story is going to go, so it seems preemptive to me to dismiss it all right off the bat and be upset with the Cranes for their current mindset. Yes, Ichabod and Katrina have a lot of bigger issues to focus on, no question, but they're going to have to address the personal aspects of everything along the way-Henry is purposefully MAKING it as personal for them as he can! And therefore, that means there has to be moments of wondering if there's still a chance to save their son and reverse course that way, too.
Heck, for all we know, Ichabod and Katrina's sympathies towards Henry could be the result of his manipulation as well. What better way to gain power than to try and mess with the loyalties of those you're directly targeting?
"His reaction was rather intense" yeah if you mean understandable. I don't blame him for reacting that way, I would've thought the same thing. His reaction wasn't surprising.
ReplyDeleteI am actually not opposed to him secretly trying to overthrow Moloch for his own benefit. I think that would be a very cool twist. The problem right now is that Henry doesn't really want anything except to lash out in his pain. Abraham at least wants Katrina, as creepy stalker as that is. We need to learn more about Henry and I would love for him to be as much of a surprise in season 2 as he was in season 1.
ReplyDeleteIcahbod comes from a code of honor so yes, his leaping to the idea that Katrina might be cheating on him was surprising and very modern TV of him.
ReplyDeleteYeah, but he should also know that she was being held captive against her will. As noted above, Abraham did impregnate her, it sure as hell wouldn't have been with her consent. That would've been my first thought, anyway.
ReplyDeleteI think this episode went a long way into showing that Ichabod and Katrina belong together. Abbie is a witness like Ichabod and that powerful bond is strong enough a relationship for them to carry the show without romanticism between them.
ReplyDeleteI loved the episode Expecting on Angel but I am usually with you on the whole mystical pregnancy thing. It wasn't a plus for me either.
ReplyDeletevery much enjoyed this ep as it combined some tight, tense action with some really nice emotional moments: obviously between Katrina/IC, but I felt the Katrina/Abbie and IC/Henry scenes were excellent. I liked the new sheriff finding some respect for team Witness even though she 's still out of the loop on everything but I'm sure that will come. As always, loved IC's rants about voting (very timely with election day tomorrow), and his disdain for dial up internet.... curious as to if Katrina with stay with the team (I hope) as it doesn't seem to make sense for her to return to Abraham as it seems that she will only be more exposed to Henry/Moloch.... loving this show
ReplyDeleteHahahaha seriously? You expect a lot from her, probably b/c you're in love with her. Lol = p...I would not have expected her to say "let's just do something." Abbie, otoh, would definitely say that. That's who she is. She proceeds with caution but she runs with it. Katrina, she'd mostly feel some type of way that Ichabod didn't listen to her. She'd plead and plead til she got blue in the face and he broke down. If Ichabod had went with Abbie's thinking, there would have been an issue. (Which iI would've hated). She wouldn't have taken it as lightly as Abbie had/has. There would've been a fuss between her and Ichabod when they were alone. Or Katrina mentally questioning them once again. (Like when Abraham tried to get in her head) I would've rolled my eyes.
ReplyDeleteThey definitely need to have a talk. When will that happen? Idk. But iI don't want the convsersation to be constantly about Henry and "My son this, and my son that." Umm nooo, Katrina needs to tell her her issues, and Abbie needs to tell her her issues with her. Have an honest relationship. Then maybe, MAYBE they can work together w/o tension.
Any ideas on what that electrical mysticism with Henry was at the end ?
ReplyDeleteI kind of hope it is essence of Moloch, trapped between Purgatory and our realm. Like a little bit of him escaped but had no vessel since they defeated the pregnancy.
ReplyDeleteThat's a creepy thought. I like that idea.
ReplyDeleteI think this is the only show I've been a fan of that has had a mystical pregnancy as part of its storyline, so that part of it all didn't really faze me one way or another, aside from me finding it creepy :p.
ReplyDeleteShe had multiple times to escape. Not to mention when they literally came to save her and she chose to stay to be a "spy" or w/e. And after her speech about her wearing the necklace so she can see "Abraham's inner human" or w/e, Ichabod wouldn't think Abraham raped her. The way she was explaining it seemed more as she was defending Abraham, with her gentle tone about the magic necklace. Also, her and Abraham were once engaged, they have history. (And to the audience, she's gotten comfortable in her captive state, being less and less terrified of Abraham's appearance)
ReplyDeleteGiven their last encounter, when she begged Abraham not to harm Ichabod and she'd returned with him, Ichabod felt some way about it. Especially when she took Abraham's hand. Sure, she did it to spare his life, but that doesn't mean Ichabod viewed it as such, and given how Ichabod and Katrina started out, him slightly thinking that something could rekindle between them, (Abraham and Katrina) isn't really...too....out there. With all these lies and secrets his mind was already in a vulnerable state, her possibly cheating on him, with her once ex-fiance, is understandable.
I remember seeing a posting about Katrina getting close to a baby later in the season and I hope that vesseless Moloch essence does not find another baby as a host.
ReplyDeleteFor Angel, if you're talking about Darla, I loved it. If you're talking about Cordelia and Connor, I absolutely hatedddddddddd that SL. And I loathedddd Jasmine with a passion. God I couldn't wait for her to die. That whole thing made me sick.
ReplyDeleteNot if his mind were already vulnerable. As I just explained above. With everything constantly snowballing (on her end). Not surprising.
ReplyDeleteI completely disagree but then again I don't hate Katrina so we are seeing the whole show from different perspectives. We'll have to agree to disagree.
ReplyDeleteYikes! I didn't think of him possessing a baby. That would be terrible. We don't need anymore hellspawn demon children on TV. They creep me out like no other.
ReplyDeleteAngel's Expecting was a standalone that created great character moments so I enjoyed that. All other mystical pregnancy stories, especially those which ran over multiple episodes or had long-standing consequences, have been a bust. Generally it's a way to create instant drama without ever earning it.
ReplyDeleteSleepy Hollow is the best ACTION/COMEDY/DRAMA/HORROR series on TV, SHO NUFF!
ReplyDeleteAction - the action and fight scenes is top notch in execution and excitement.
Comedy - the witty exchanges between Abbie and Ichabod is a show by it's self.
Drama - the writing and acting are some of the best on TV.
Horror - $#!T get's real in Sleepy Hollow (the Mohawk Sandman, the Piped Piper, the Wailing Lady).
Excellent episode..............next week looks just as good! 4 THE SLEEPY HEAD NATION, I am still Nobody!!!
It's not b/c I hate Katrina, it's b/c there's evidence there, that would make him think that. Did he have to think that first? No he didn't. But for him not to think that at all, with the doubts he's already had in his head about not being sure if he can trust her, THAT'S what would be surprising. He simply asked her, he didn't accuse her of it. But it's fine, I don't mind agreeing to disagree.
ReplyDeleteAh, I see. I haven't seen "Angel", but it's nice to know that that episode managed to make that storyline work all right. But I certainly understand why such a plot would bother people-pregnancy is a tough thing to get right on TV as it is, because of all the dramatic changes it brings to the storyline and characters involved. I don't doubt it'd be even tougher if you make the pregnancy a mystical one. Should just be grateful that this particular pregnancy only lasted for a few hours and didn't produce a baby...presuming there's no aftereffects we need to worry about, that is.
ReplyDeleteI must say trying to bring the end of days to earth, trying to kill everyone, and attempting to kill me numerous times would be kind of a deal breaker on any potential redemption for a family member of mine, no matter how close to me they are, Abbie is 100% right on this
ReplyDeleteyeah i don't how he's able to be saved
ReplyDeletei'm so glad katrina's out of that disgusting place, ichabod and katrina i know he's your son but COME ON!!!! he chose moloch and was excited for katrina to die, i loved the voting scene it was very poignant from the times evolving and lol at ichabod and katrina talking about katrina's clothes and the "magic" radio lol
ReplyDeleteWanted to make some points but I found myself completely agreeing with @Dahne and @AvonleaMist. So, what they said.
ReplyDeleteSadly, some fan want IC and Abbie be a couple which I don't want it for this time.
ReplyDeleteBut they're only showing it towards Henry...which is what makes them selfish because he's their son. Why not see the good in Abraham? Why not try to redeem Abraham? Having the Horsemen of Death on their side or totally out of the picture would certainly stop/stall the coming apocalypse.
ReplyDeleteHowever, 7 episodes in to this season no one has said we can save Abraham, instead it's let's use/manipulate Abraham but we must see the good in our son! We've seen more love/caring/humanity out of Abraham than Henry...but it's all about Henry for Ichabod/Katrina...which means it's not about stopping the Apocalypse it's about their family/epic love...which is what makes them selfish and what's pissing me off about the show this season.
BTW - I'm not arguing for redemption for either Henry or Abraham but there's a decided double standard there that implies their motivation with Henry has NOTHING to do with the fate of the world and everything to do with the Crane Family Drama.
Also, other than raising Mary what has Henry done to make it personal? Everything else has been part of a master plan, the fake future was to get a key to bring Moloch into this world. The blood ritual with Katrina/Headless was part of Moloch's plan/deal; the Coin was a distraction and attack against the witnesses, more Abbie than Ichabod. The Pied Piper was so he could get the bone to make a curse for Joe and, Joe was used to get the poison which was used (at Moloch's direction) to once again attempt to bring Moloch into this world and jump start the Apocalypse.
Henry is going to be Ichabod's undoing....I hope that they are able to reach his humanity in time....as the way things are going looks like Ichabod is going to die trying.
ReplyDeleteahhhhhhhhh damn them... they are making me like Abraham and I don't wanna like him....
ReplyDeletenot really loving this season or the backpedaling of whatever thin canon they had established. so Moloch being born was his plan B for entering this world when before he was just going to go through the door to purgatory, uh sure.
ReplyDeleteoh, and remember when they said over and over again that death needed his head before the other horsemen could come and that he was never a man at all and that is why he couldn't die. just some examples of how they recon more times then i can count. also, it shows how chaotic and unfocused this show has become and how i can't really give a shit about Henry or Katrina or anyone really. to many tropes, to much recon, to much yawntastic meandering "adventures"
Amen Sara! This was the first episode of SH that made me question why I keep watching it. The only thing I found redeeming was the voting scene. Other than that, I could have skipped this one! After the show was over, I told my wife, I see why the ratings are dropping through the floor now.
ReplyDeleteHow do we know they won't feel that way about Abraham, though? Given how long Katrina's spent with him, and the way she talked about him last night, she's already showing some sign of sympathy towards him, so I could see her convincing Ichabod to try and save Abraham, too. Especially if he is indeed showing moments of seemingly genuine compassion towards Katrina, like he did last night. Sure, some of their determination to save Henry is personally motivated, but I do believe they also genuinely think that redeeming him can help in the greater fight they're dealing with, too. At least, I think Katrina certainly thinks that. I don't know if Ichabod's willing to go that far in his belief, not yet anyway.
ReplyDeleteI dunno, I think it seems perfectly logical that selfishness would play a role at some point in this battle. The moment we learned Henry was actually the Cranes' son, it was obviously going to have to get deeply personal at some point, and therefore that means there's going to be some selfish decisions made as a result. Is that selfishness problematic for their main mission? Absolutely. But instead of being upset about this new twist in the story, I find the dilemma fascinating. There's all sorts of themes within it to explore: How far would you go for family? Is it possible to find the good amidst the evil, and if so, how do you work with that for the greater good? And if you can't, how do you go about dealing with that realization? Ichabod has shown some hesitation with his sentiments about Henry, in large part because he doesn't have the same sort of bond with his son that Katrina got to have, so seeing his push and pull between what Abbie's telling him and what Katrina's telling him, I find that interesting. The selfishness against the greater good is a battle that I'm curious to see play out.
And then there's the reasons why they're so willing to try and rescue their son, from the blatantly obvious (he's their son) to the murky (is Henry manipulating them to believe he can be redeemed for his own gain? We don't know just how much of an effect Ichabod's time in Purgatory at the end of last season had on his mental state, after all) that I'm looking forward to exploring further. I see a lot of good story opportunity in this situation. Characters aren't always going to make the best/most logical choices, after all.
As for Henry making it personal, well, bringing Katrina back to the place where she gave birth to him to keep her captive certainly seems pretty personally motivated to me. And Moloch wants him to turn her, and he's not exactly refusing or fighting back against that command. Plus there was his speech to Ichabod last night, and impregnating Katrina. He's clearly got plans for her specifically.
I don't see the show as selling us on Ichabod being right about this situation at all. I think they want us to side with Abbie. And ultimately, it's another of the many tests these friends will have to go through to prove how committed they are not just to each other, but the mission as a whole (after all, fans have tossed out theories that one of them may not actually be one of the intended Witnesses, so that could be an issue as well down the line, too). The big drama's just beginning, they're simply setting the stages now, and I think the more we see of this season the more we'll see just how safe in his convictions Ichabod may or may not be.
A person who attended a panel discussion on Sunday with the Deliverance writers said the writers intended Abbie to be the voice of the audience in the scene when she was outvoted by the Cranes.
ReplyDeleteI noted this above - according to the writers' Abbie was expressing what they consider to be the audience's POV, not the Cranes. Don't get pissed off just yet! Hang on . . . :D
ReplyDeleteI feel exactly the same way. For a character who was the Big Bad for much of the season last year, he has gotten a lot more sympathetic, if not less psychotic, this season.
ReplyDeleteThe canon has been problematic. It is worrisome since we are only in the second season. It usually takes shows a few years to start breaking canon left and right.
ReplyDeleteindeed, and couple that with the low/sliding ratings i don't really hold out hope for this show. i feel like they go "lets throw it all at the wall and see what sticks" which is a poor mentality for any show especially a genre show.
ReplyDeleteI agree Abby is right about Henry. Katrina's guilt over abadoning her baby and Icabod's vision of the lost boy running through the woods screaming for help has clouded their vision as to who their child has become as a man. For Icabod and Katrina to have faith their son can be saved is one thing, but it's that faith which gives Henry even more opportunities to strike at them. Henry is his parents weak spot, and he preys upon weakness.
ReplyDeleteI think this episode showed how much Icabod loves Katrina, but it also shows that Icabod's love for his wife is causing him to turn a blind eye to the secrets she has kept from him. Okay ... not so much as turning a blind eye, but Icabod is doing a really good job of overlooking or just not dealing with Katrina when he uncovers something previously unknown about her. I just get the feeling the surface has just been scratched when it comes to Katrina. I don't think she is evil by any means, but Katrina appears to be somewhat manipulative in order to control people and situations to her liking.
ReplyDeleteI guess she did not become a witch by accident.
ReplyDelete