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POLL : What did you think of Hannibal - Mizumono?

May 24, 2014

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84 comments:

  1. ShOwFrEaKMay 24, 2014 at 4:00 AM

    My head is spinning... Ahhh, my head is spinning....

    ReplyDelete
  2. Ralph HartmanMay 24, 2014 at 4:03 AM

    I can't tell you what I think cause the fucking Phillies game has been airing all hour here in New Jersey. Hopefully it airs once it's over but since it's already eleven NBC will probably just start the news instead.

    ReplyDelete
  3. DebsterforeverMay 24, 2014 at 4:05 AM

    OH THANK YOU BRYAN FULLER FOR LIEING ABOUT ABIGAIL!

    YOU'RE A GENIUS NOBODY CAN EXPECT WHAT YOU DO ON THIS SHOW WITH THIS AWESOME ACTORS

    AWESOME AWESOME AWESOME

    EVEN BETTER THAN BREAKING BAD AND THAT WAS IMPOSSIBLE

    ReplyDelete
  4. PriceMay 24, 2014 at 4:13 AM

    Thank you NBC for giving Hannibal a season 3, and assuring that I didn't have a heart attack at the thought of that being the ending. I think that was the most beautiful season finale I have ever seen and I can't wait till season 3. Amazing.

    ReplyDelete
  5. DiabetesMan88May 24, 2014 at 4:21 AM

    That was without a doubt one of the most brutal season finales of a tv show ever. It will be cool if they make season 3 into the book "Hannibal", have him it get caught. Then have season 4 be Red Dragon and season 5 be Silence of the Lambs.

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  6. DarthLocke4May 24, 2014 at 4:40 AM

    Awesome!


    -Suspicions about Abigail turned out to be right, but sadly wrong about her life being so short lived.
    -Hannibal uttered the words of Mason Verger from the Hannibal film ('rabbit screams, the fox comes a running')
    -Was half right about Cynthia Nixon's character. Did replace Jack, but Jack so far is not in a comma
    -And the ending! Fuller definitely channeled his inner Du Maurier! (and nice juxtaposition to scenes from last finale and possibly the Hannibal film version airplane scenes)
    -So where did Hannibal go? 3 guesses! 1.France (reason: Lady Murasaki + Du Maurier parable), 2. Japan (reason: Lady Murasaki + nice lead in for 'red dragon'/Tooth Fairy AND Buffalo Bill), 3. Florence Italy (reason: "Bella" conversation + Claw in Will similar to Pazzi + mentioning of Hannibal's "memory palace" = prelude to Hannibal film/novel)
    - Who lives? Will & Jack. Not so sure about Alana, but I hope so, simply for Will to have something to hold onto an rebuild from. I suspect we could see Chilton, Lass, and maybe even Gideon again too!


    What I kind of theorize about: what if for some reason Hannibal comes back to the states and he crosses paths with people related to Starling (playing with hit and miss fate)


    The art/cinematography was brilliant in these one and I loved the conversation about "ideals"!
    Can't wait for next year and/or when we get spoilers again!!!!!!!!!

    ReplyDelete
  7. DarthLocke4May 24, 2014 at 4:41 AM

    There's one other character (although a better word may be change/transform/orallow for acceptence), but we haven't met her yet!!!!!!!!!!!

    ReplyDelete
  8. DarthLocke4May 24, 2014 at 4:44 AM

    You really couldn't do it that way with out SOTL being first, because it's important to see Clarice's transformation, but no doubt season 3 will parallel "Hannibal" in some ways since he's on the run...

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  9. azrael_1289May 24, 2014 at 5:37 AM

    Wow. What a finale!
    I forgive you Will; do you forgive me?
    Can't believe I have to wait almost an year for Hannibal to return :/

    ReplyDelete
  10. KaraMay 24, 2014 at 5:44 AM

    Well that was... absolutely devastating. Thank the lord that wasn't the series finale or I'd be calling it the worst one ever. Can't wait for season 3!

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  11. nobodyMay 24, 2014 at 5:44 AM

    I told you "MuthaLovers"..................ABIGAIL HOBBS LIVES, wait..................NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! Nobody, 4 NOW!!!

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  12. Luana ArturiMay 24, 2014 at 5:44 AM

    WOW.
    The acting was amazing through out, specially tthat last scene between Will and Hannibal.
    Can't believe they brought Abigail back just to kill her again.
    I'm so glad we have another season! Can't wait!

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  13. magnutudeMay 24, 2014 at 6:15 AM

    Mind blown...... what an amazingly awesome and depressing finale... so happy that there will be another season to continue the stylish yet bloody rampage that Hannibal will wreak from here on out, and that this wasn't where this tale stopped. From the as usual stunning visuals, to the wtf?! twist in the end credit scene, just an outstanding ep

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  14. inhighheelsMay 24, 2014 at 6:24 AM

    My god, this was "end of series due to lack of characters". If they hand't confirmed S3, I'd be pretty sure no one survived. Btw, how long does it take for the FBI to answer a call?! 30 minutes? "Hey, I'm dying here, together with three other people, in the hands of a mass murderer serial killer!"... 30 minutes later, an ambulance comes through. JFC.

    But by FAR my favorite thing was Hannibal and Bedelia. Because Mads + Gillian is like heaven.

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  15. TheHindu TimesMay 24, 2014 at 6:29 AM

    They don't have the rights to the character of Clarice. I suspect they will chop things up and give certain plots to will and save SOTL for last with someone filling her role, but named something different.

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  16. Gohier123May 24, 2014 at 6:44 AM

    At the end of the first season Will was framed for killing five people. At the end of this season he was gutted, literally. It would be nice for Will to actually win for once. But I guess that's what happens when you're up against Hannibal Lecter.

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  17. NiceGuyVanMay 24, 2014 at 7:08 AM

    Wow, just wow. How much more chaos can you ask for than this!
    Can't wait to watch this again with friends who haven't watched it yet.

    ReplyDelete
  18. lilyMay 24, 2014 at 7:11 AM

    Predictable, unfortunately. We knew fro mthe movies that Will was gonna get seriously maimed by Hannibal. I knew Abigail was alive, since we never saw her corpse or any parts of it, and Bryan Fuller seems can't help but repeat himself with "surprising" resurrections.
    But i am glad that Alana, jack and Abigail got their asses handed to them. Abigail is probably a goner (God, i hope so)

    Alana will survive to be able to grovel to Will for thinking him a murderer and choosing to pork the wrong guy. Eck!
    From the emotional standpoint three characters i hate got gutted one way or another so the finale was very rewarding but poor Will Hhe didn't deserve what happened to him. Can't wait to see how Abigail lovers will jump to her defense now, she basically was the reason he dropped his guard down. But i am sure her fans will find some reason to paint her as a victim yet again.

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  19. george257May 24, 2014 at 7:32 AM

    Two months ago I stated "I don't think I saw anything that would imply Abigail Hobbs (or Beverly, Miriam, ...) is dead. "

    The very next episode seemed to show the death of Beverly in the most definitive way ever shown on tv or film.

    Now, the finale showed will act in the most unbelievable way possible after seeing Abigail and proof Hannibal abducted her, failing to immediately arrest Hannibal, even so far as with a gun in his right hand getting stabbed by Hannibal without any attempt to shoot back in self defense, instead dropping the gun and with the same hand squeezing Hannibal's shoulder, if he can squeeze he can shoot. Then to top it all off he is the most rude to Hannibal as he can possibly be, provoking him to hurt Abigail. Thus, this is the most clear cut way of showing that will is complicit in the murder or attempted murder of Abigail, while acting like he did not want it to happen.

    There is getting to be so many inconsistencies in the show that I just don't care at all what happens to the characters.

    There does not seem to be any point discussing them any further because it has now starting to be the norm for the show.

    Therefore, I will refrain from discussing my observations about the show in future.

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  20. george257May 24, 2014 at 7:41 AM

    Two months ago I stated "I don't think I saw anything that would imply Abigail Hobbs (or Beverly, Miriam, ...) is dead. "

    The very next episode seemed to show the death of Beverly in the most definitive way ever shown on tv or film.

    Now,
    the finale showed will act in the most unbelievable way possible after
    seeing Abigail and proof Hannibal abducted her, failing to immediately
    arrest Hannibal, even so far as with a gun in his right hand getting
    stabbed by Hannibal without any attempt to shoot back in self defense,
    instead dropping the gun and with the same hand squeezing Hannibal's
    shoulder, if he can squeeze he can shoot. Then to top it all off he is
    the most rude to Hannibal as he can possibly be, provoking him to hurt
    Abigail. Thus, this is the most clear cut way of showing that will is
    complicit in the murder or attempted murder of Abigail, while acting
    like he did not want it to happen.

    There is getting to be so many inconsistencies in the show that I just don't care at all what happens to the characters.

    There does not seem to be any point discussing them any further because it has now starting to be the norm for the show.

    Therefore, I will refrain from discussing my observations about the show in future.

    ReplyDelete
  21. GraydonMay 24, 2014 at 8:01 AM

    That was the most disturbing yet beautiful work I've ever seen, Is it weird to say that it frightens me a little that I enjoy the show so much?

    ReplyDelete
  22. Claire McCrorieMay 24, 2014 at 9:06 AM

    In my head, this show simultaneously is awesome and deeply disturbing. I both question why i watch it, and look forward to new episodes. So glad it was renewed - brilliant!

    ReplyDelete
  23. Banged by Chris EvansMay 24, 2014 at 9:25 AM

    Will was stabbed by Hannibal almost the same way it happened in the Red Dragon movie.

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  24. LouMay 24, 2014 at 9:32 AM

    I hate Hannibal Lecter so much right now, like how he got offended at Will 'betraying' him, how bloody delusional are you? I hate the hold he has over his victims, like Abigail, Miriam and now Du Maurier. I really hope the show lasts long enough so he can be caught and have that smug smile wiped of his face permanently.


    Anyway the finale made up for the last few episodes for me at least.

    ReplyDelete
  25. Lil missMay 24, 2014 at 11:52 AM

    I'll be really gutted if they don't get the rights to clarice!

    ReplyDelete
  26. DarthLocke4May 24, 2014 at 12:26 PM

    I think they just don't have the rights to SOTL, Clarice is also a Hannibal character (like Jack and Chilton, Mason, and Margot) so I think they could introduce her, but they just couldn't follow The Buffalo Bill storyline.


    Personally since he's taken so much time reference Clarice and some of SOTL, I would be very disappointed if he did not at least create a parable/parallel female. It's so important because of Mischa and his family crest that some kind of black-bird-girl with a strong mind and lack of taste appears in order for Hannibal himself to be fully realized, especially now that we see him cut into Will, proving that he is not his "Star-ling"...

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  27. DarthLocke4May 24, 2014 at 12:27 PM

    I'll be gutted AND eaten. :(

    ReplyDelete
  28. DarthLocke4May 24, 2014 at 12:27 PM

    Seriously, that it how it went in my head as it played out onscreen! XD

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  29. DarthLocke4May 24, 2014 at 12:46 PM

    I disagree. I believed that before the season started that she was alive and Mirian Glass was proof of my beliefs, where I knew Katz would also die, as these things are so highly reflective to the source material.


    Will I think has been torn a good chunk of the time and I think seeing Abigail put him in total shock (The promise of something he wanted thought was lost returned to him and then taken away...a mirror to Hannibal)


    It's hard to explain without being spoilerish, but Will and Abigail represent a window/opportunity to Hannibal's past and things he's lost and seems to be step in a bigger evolution in relation to another character that has yet to be introduced...Will's deception broke Hannibal's heart so what we watched him do here, was reflective and a painful reminder of what he couldn't have yet again.

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  30. DarthLocke4May 24, 2014 at 12:50 PM

    It's also parallel to how Inspector Pazzi's little pick-pocket in "Hannibal" also gets attacked by Hannibal on the streets of Florence and similar to how Hannibal deals with Pazzi...

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  31. DarthLocke4May 24, 2014 at 1:01 PM

    Bedelia Du Maurier is definitely a reference to Daphne Du Maurier and so her character may not be simply manipulated, as much as just crazy herself. If you have ever read or seen Hitchcock's adaptations of The Birds or Rebecca, then one might suspect that she would represent those woman who fall in love in horrific circumstances and just don't care why...She is Hannibal's "person suit" after all!


    Obviously what Hannibal did was really really sad, but knowing where he is coming from, I can also see his own pain being displayed...I think he wanted things to turn out rather different. He wanted to get something back, but Will and especially Kade ruined it. Now Will will understand Hannibal's own losses much much more, as Hannibal just forced Will into his own shoes.

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  32. DarthLocke4May 24, 2014 at 1:04 PM

    Most of the characters are victims, even Hannibal. That's why Harris' work is so good I think. I agree that Abigail is not innocent, but she was sort of Stockholm syndromed by her father to begin with and that's not necessarily her fault. I think she looked genuinely scared in the final scene, even though I think she got what was coming to her by pushing Alana out the window.


    I think the real lynch pin was Kade Prurnell, it caused everyone to over react.

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  33. DebraFanMay 24, 2014 at 1:07 PM

    My jaw is on the floor and refuses to come back to its position. Mind blowing finale. EPIC!!!

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  34. steve182010May 24, 2014 at 1:17 PM

    i think one thing alana learned is dont rely on the police when you call them about hearing gun shots because they are slow she got pushed out a window will got stab in the gut and abigail got her throat cut before the police even showed up.
    i wonder who survives i think will will survive alana might but be condfined to a wheel chair jack didnt jack die when he had the phne and his wife said hi im sure he died and alana i hope she survives but i think they will kill her off just so when will gets his revenge he is gonna be even moer angry since he thought he already lost her and then he watches get her throat cut so she will probably die just so it gives will more reason to wanna not catch but kill hannibal

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  35. DebsterforeverMay 24, 2014 at 1:32 PM

    I hope the show lasts long enough so he can escape and be together with Clarice.

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  36. Rob FMay 24, 2014 at 1:39 PM

    WOW! That is probably the best season finale of any TV show i have ever watched, the last 20 minutes my jaw was literally on the floor until the end.

    ReplyDelete
  37. fabaaMay 24, 2014 at 2:20 PM

    i just wanted any indication that Chilton is alive. Let Jack, Abigail and Alana stay dead so we can get him back.

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  38. DebsterforeverMay 24, 2014 at 2:32 PM

    Maybe I'm stupid but I didn't predict that Abigail appears and is going to throw Alana out of the window. I also was so sure that they reproduce the Red-Dragon-Scene and Hannibal gets shot. I never was suprpised like that before by a TV show.

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  39. DebraFanMay 24, 2014 at 2:50 PM

    Will is obviously going to survive. Jack's chances are very bright. Abigail will surely end up dead. The character I am most concerned about is Alana. I like her (even though she was relegated to the background in S2) and I hope that she survives and doesn't end up being a paraplegic. Would love to see her recover fully from her injuries and team up with Will in the manhunt for Hannibal.

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  40. DarthLocke4May 24, 2014 at 2:50 PM

    I think half the fun is when characters are suddenly revealed to be alive!

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  41. DarthLocke4May 24, 2014 at 3:01 PM

    I think that Red Dragon scene is probably going to be for the end of next season, since season 4 is Red Dragon Era according to Fuller's previous plans...


    I thought Abigail could be alive for many reasons, but mostly because I know what she "should" mean to Hannibal (assuming Fuller would be true to that), and the press release also heightened my suspicions, as both the actress was listed, and there was suppose to be some reason that Will nearly changes his mind --and the only thing that would make sense would be the reveal of Abigail, but with that being said, I too could not have predicted the exact circumstance of that reveal, including Abi pushing Alana out the window and only for Hannibal to resort to taking control by destroying his own vision out of retaliation and utter heartbreak.

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  42. george257May 24, 2014 at 3:15 PM

    Ok, lets discuss some more.

    I don't think Abigail Hobbs or a similar character is mentioned in any of the five books nor in any of the five movies nor in the history of Dr. Trevino.

    In any rate, the story is inconsistent with the source material, in terms of good and bad characters.

    For example, the writers of the tv show has made will gram, jack crawford, alana bloom, and abigail hobbs to each have attempted murder on many separate occasions (not self defense, manslaughter, etc, but full fledged attempted murder) where in the source material they never came close to this degree of criminality. All four are no different than hannibal in terms of good and bad. Sure, hannibal is more bad then the four, but the four are certainly more bad than good. Otherwise, someone who thinks they are justified with attempted murder would be considered more good than bad.

    For this reason, I would be deeply impressed if the writers completely kill off all four of will gram, jack crawford, alana bloom, and abigail hobbs on episode 1 of season 3, and introduce new original characters that are more good than bad that prevail against hannibal.

    These four had enough chances to stop Hannibal, not only did they fail, but they chose to be bad and justify being bad because of trying to stop Hannibal. In the real world with a real criminal, all four would be dead. I don't care what happened in any of the characters past, it does not excuse their actions, including Hannibal.

    Would it really be so much to ask to show some law enforcement that are good at their job, follow the rules, and do more good than bad?

    It would be so refreshing if the show condemns corruption and attempted murder rather than ending up glorifying it and portraying it as acceptable.

    That would show true courage on the part of the writers.

    However, this is unlikely because the writers has left the possibility of the characters return next season, and the writers might not be so skilled as to be able to pull this off.

    In any case, it is very clear that the tv show has irreversibly damaged the integrity and credibility of the characters will gram, jack crawford, alana bloom, and abigail hobbs as much as the tv show has damaged their bodies at the end of season 2.



    The show keeps reiterating the theme of "at a certain point it stops being self defense and becomes murder". It is clear that each of these four characters has moved beyond this point and if these characters are in season 3, the show risks loosing more of its credibility, and being more inconsistent.


    What does it matter how well the tv show is made, it does not change the fact that attempted murder is bad, and it should not be portrayed as acceptable.

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  43. george257May 24, 2014 at 3:36 PM

    But in a show this gruesome, any implied death not clearly shown, especially of a main character, only serves to suggest the character is alive, and suggest reason to doubt the credibility of characters that assumes another character is dead rather than missing but possibly alive.
    Most unfortunately, any resurrection of a clearly shown death only serves to subvert the credibility of other deaths.

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  44. inhighheelsMay 24, 2014 at 3:42 PM

    There is a Stockholm syndrome element to Bedelia, that's for sure. But I'm inclined to believe she is actually very smart, in a serial killer-y kinda way, not simply insane. Obviously, to some extent, serial killers are disturbed, but not necessarily delusional, as with associated with psychosis. Of course she is afraid of Hannibal, since she has a brain left, but to me it seems as if she was planning this with him for a very long time.
    She ran off, but she came back. And, IMO, there was no reason for her coming back other than playing Jack and Will.

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  45. inhighheelsMay 24, 2014 at 3:51 PM

    They need to buy t-shirts, really. And start wearing cool leather stuff.
    Btw, they should make it realistic enough and have *everyone* get lessons on personal defense. Alana was pushed through a window by Abigail, who's pretty much a teenager, and she's supposed to be FBI. The woman must know how to properly kick some ass, especially if her goal in life now is, presumably, hunting Hannibal.

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  46. DarthLocke4May 24, 2014 at 4:20 PM

    Exactly! I mean we saw Hannibal go to her apartment, so no doubt he was still hoping to run away with Will, but one of them must of reached out to the other to plant her as a mole...

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  47. DarthLocke4May 24, 2014 at 4:25 PM

    Abigail Hobbs is mentioned in the novel Red Dragon, but obviously, and as Fuller has stated,i n his version she represents his sister Mischa (See Hannibal and Hannibal Rising) and ultimately is a foreshadowing to Clarice Starling, as Clarice holds Mischa's place in Hannibal's mind/Memory Palace (Georgia M. Mariaum Lass,and Alana Bloom also all represent and share certain aspects with Starling at certain times in certain books. The change with Margot too also back shadows Mischa "sister" and creates an evolution to Abigail, but with "taste", and foreshadows Starling - iMargot is her friend, connected to Hannibal novel and iconic "pig" scene, and represents either a parallel or juxtapostion--this depends on if they transform her to the buth from the novel or not-- to "taste")


    I never said it wasn't murder, but rather that the show and source material reflect a look at "ablism" (it matters and is important to understand why people do things if we want a better society) and like the novels ask: If civility and art are really spiritually transforming elements that separates us from animals or are those things false facades for a more complicated game of survival of fittest?"If the end of the Hannibal novel is any consultation, then the answer is that with human perception "love conquers all" and is a transformation thing.


    I am working on a blog post that I may ask to submit to spoiler TV in relation to how Bryan Fuller as used the source material (because he smacks us in the face with it in every single episode) and IMO he is right in line with what Harris was presenting, especially in Hannibal novel and extended through Hannibal Rising


    It's not inconsistent. It's not hard to fathom that hid Abigail away somewhere and that he either or Du Maurier reached out to each other so that Hannibal could be certain. In Harris 3 book, the Hannibal self titled novel, it becomes abundantly clear that Hannibal is a post modern horror-romance and ANTHROPOMORPHIC story, meaning there are elements of something almost "beyond human" in relation to Hannibal and his life. Fuller IMO just homed in on it and presented the whole story from the start with that concept in mind

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  48. DarthLocke4May 24, 2014 at 4:36 PM

    In a TV seres it creates suspense and interesting elements of surprise (and in this case it's also a theme). It's no secret that we are coming back for season three and I think given where we are in the story and reading Bryan's interviews that Jack and Will are givens to return.


    I have seen comments about Hannibal gutting the others, but really what he did was get his 'digs in' and left some of them with a small chance of life....If he would have been really gruesome and disrespectful, he would of grabbed some organs and saw to it that they where dead. He even just let Alana lie there as he walked by her.

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  49. IvyBMay 24, 2014 at 4:39 PM

    They don't have the rights to any character introduced in 'Silence of the Lambs': Clarice, Ardelia, Jame Gumb, Barney, Paul Krendler, etc. Doesn't matter if they appeared in 'Hannibal' later, if their first appearance was 'Silence', they're off the table until MGM comes to their senses and learn that sharing is caring.

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  50. george257May 24, 2014 at 5:06 PM

    ok, then wiki page on HL is inaccurate and needs updating.

    attempted murder should not be tolerated, even if for love

    the four characters are inconsistant in the tv show, but they were not inconsistant in the source material.

    inconsistent means acting at variance with one's own principles or former conduct.

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  51. george257May 24, 2014 at 5:15 PM

    The *story* in the tv show is changed so much it no longer seems to be comparable to source material.


    The characters of jack and will have been changes so much and made so evil they are now past the point of reasonable redemption, they are now the bad guys pure and simple.


    Hannibal needed to flee a certain radius before authorities showed up. He would not know for certain from which direction they would come. He did not have any time to waste. In a situation like that seconds matter.

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  52. DarthLocke4May 24, 2014 at 6:30 PM

    I'm not saying that murder should or should not be tolerated (that is for each viewer to decide), but that FICTIONAL stories that use serial killers as protagonists and/or anti-heroes are going to go beyond the black and white pale on social justice, because there is also a debate about human purpose and argumentation philosophy thrown in to examine what being "human" really is.


    This story is about identity. There are no major inconsistencies from the novels, only changes of certain things in order to flesh out Harris story on Hannibal's viewpoint and legacy. The things that have been changed have so far only been used to accentuate on past and future events by making beautiful artistic parallels and preludes to those events.

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  53. DarthLocke4May 24, 2014 at 6:44 PM

    How so? Beverly Katz death and Bella's survival feeds into Hannibal's odd's with his Japanese Aunt's Eastern philosophy, which has been hinted at in every episode. She paralleled Hannibal by not listening to her friend's advice, which is the exact reason Hannibal must leave France, but more over the grandoise nature of having to kill Katz and his grandiose display of her in "layers" is reflective of that nerve or "bad chord" being hit him, as he likes the fight against death and God...


    Rebirth has also been highly thematic, because again looking at "Hannibal", Hannibal is trying to find away to bring Mischa back...Fuller used Hannibal's admiration of Stephen Hawkings "time in reverse" with Tea-cup analogy beautifully in both season with Will's ability now being "time in reverse", calling Will his fragile little tea-cup, and Abigail being drugged and dropping Hannibal's teacup to the floor, let alone actually having Hannibal discuss it with Will right at the end of this season.


    Alana (and harpsichord + waltz philosophy = Starling at the end of Hannibal), Mariam juxtaposes starling with "duty" and is rising star of jack Crawford's, but was weak and could be manipulated by Hannibal, which Starling is not.


    The show is also about the concept of Free Will, if there is such a thing when we all have a tendency to directly and indirectly effect each other's lives both physically and psychologically.


    Again the anthropomorphic quality plays to "myth" and/or supernatural elements. This show isn't about realism, it's about defying realism through the subjectivity of perception of reality and emotion with an element of "fate"...

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  54. HyndaraMay 24, 2014 at 7:34 PM

    I've now watched the finale for the third time and I can't get enough of it yet! This is such a brilliant episode! It could also have worked perfectly as a show finale (hopeful there's a looooooong run until we are there), but I'm more than happy that there will be a season 3 - unless that is truly more than one hell of a Hiatus we are now looking at ...
    Gorgeous disturbing on all ends: writing, acting, filming, exection. A Masterpiece!

    ReplyDelete
  55. BooneMay 24, 2014 at 8:50 PM

    What a finale.. Bryan Fuller is a mad genius.

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  56. Boris BreyninMay 24, 2014 at 10:40 PM

    That's what makes Hannibal worth watching! the wait and anticipation of whats next to come.

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  57. DarthLocke4May 25, 2014 at 12:07 AM

    Then why is Chilton introduced?

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  58. shredMay 25, 2014 at 8:15 AM

    Oh good lord! And we have to wait till next year for season 3?! WHAT IS THIS CRAP?!

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  59. IvyBMay 25, 2014 at 9:45 AM

    The thing is, Jack and Chilton were FIRST introduced in 'Red Dragon', which Bryan Fuller has the right to. The problem is characters that were FIRST introduced in 'Silence', which MGM has the rights to, and they're not willing to share. Paul Krendler was in 'Silence', he was the DoD pencil-pusher talking to the Senator and dismissing Clarice, unfortunately they made him an OTT caricature and misogynist in 'Hannibal', but that's another story.


    It is MGM, because they're trying to get Lifetime to make the Clarice series. They hold the rights, Lifetime is just their channel of choice, Bryan Fuller already approached MGM before S1 (he wanted to do the story of Raspail from 'Silence' in S1, which ended up being Franklyn and Tobias) and even offered them to be able to use Hannibal himself (by sending letters from him to Lifetime's Clarice, like he did in canon) but MGM said 'no, what's yours is yours and what's our is ours'. I hope they come to their senses before S5, I want to have 'Clarice' and a 'Silence of the Lambs' season.

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  60. DarthLocke4May 25, 2014 at 1:20 PM

    Thanks for better explaining.


    I seriously forgot that Paul was in SOTL.


    I always liked that Paul K. becomes Clarice's nemesis, because it created a parallel to Paul the fisherman in Hannibal Rising and gave her and Hannibal some commonality...


    I want to see Silence of Lambs of course, but I'm also very interested in seeing Hannibal (novel), because I would like to see how Fuller would flesh her out to become the person she does by the end of the novel, since I think Harris doesn't exactly explain it, only partially. My only concern is if Fuller would try and make a love triangle out of Hannibal, Will, and Clarice. I think Will and Clarice could have a nice brother and sister dynamic, but I hope we do not see an Alana reduex, because that would take away Clarice's significance IMO.

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  61. IvyBMay 25, 2014 at 1:55 PM

    No problem.
    I don't mind Krendler being an antagonist, what I hate is how all the characters became such OTT cliche/caricatures in order to make Hannibal look good in 'Hannibal' and be an anti-hero you root for and don't get me started on Clarice's ending. Krendler became a misogynistic pig, Pazzi was corrupt and from a long line of traitors and don't get me started on Mason and his tear martini.
    I'd like to see a sibling-like relationship between Will and Clarice (I think Jack would fit the father figure more than Will). I wouldn't mind Will and Hannibal battling it out for Clarice's soul, but please, for the love of God, no love triangle. I also don't want Hannibal/Clarice (the only ship I have for Hannibal is Hannibal/Suffering, Will and Clarice deserve better. I could be open to Hannibal/Bedelia, depending on how shady she is next season).Basically I hated 'Hannibal', won't even bother mentioning 'Hannibal Rising' and I'm both itnrigued and dreading what Fuller would choose to do.

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  62. DarthLocke4May 25, 2014 at 2:06 PM

    I love the way Hannibal was written and want to see that ending (and some), because even Hannibal's ancestry (Teutonic Knights) they have a black bird on their family crest and Clarice is able to transform Hannibal also by giving him acceptance and I have always liked his dedication to her. I like Hannibal being an anti-hero and that Harris had the courage to make law enforcement just as corruptible as anything else. To me Harris wrote a horror romance where love transcends and I think it's important that Fuller remain true to that.

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  63. IvyBMay 25, 2014 at 2:10 PM

    Well, we're just going to have to agree to disagree on that one.

    ReplyDelete
  64. DarthLocke4May 25, 2014 at 4:41 PM

    That's fine by me! :)

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  65. lilyMay 25, 2014 at 7:32 PM

    The only moments that surprise me in hannibal are the ones that picture different mutilated corpses. Not to brag but everything else can be easily predicted, except Bedelia siding with Hannibal. I still don't get the reason they need her on the show other than the desire of the creators to capitalise on Gillian Anderson's pre-existing fan base.
    As for Abigail being not dead i suspected as much as soon as the second season started and instead of her body we saw blood on the kitchen floor. I even asked people here whether she is truly dead or what's her deal? Because i was so confused by the lack of her body. And then Lass popped up alive and i knew Abigail was also alive. NO ONE in Hannibal's universe simply dies.
    I assure you Chilton is most likely also alive. We saw the bullet fired and it had hit his head but unless you actually see a mutilated corpse on Hannibal, that person is not dead. He is either in a coma or a vegetable struggling to start functioning fully again. And that's why Crawford couldn't use him to build charges against Hannibal.

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  66. EuphemiaWonderlandMay 25, 2014 at 11:16 PM

    Amazing finale. I can't wait for season 3.

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  67. Joshua AJBMay 26, 2014 at 2:02 AM

    What did I just watch?!


    Mind blown. Epic.

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  68. george257May 26, 2014 at 8:58 AM

    what???

    are you saying there is a debate in the fictional tv show on whether murders are more human and more fit for survival than non-murders?

    the story is not set in the time of clan of the cave bear.

    those who follow the law are more fit for survival in a society of laws.

    Look, it is clear they put thought into some of the little details, but it seems like they got lost in the little details and neglected the bigger picture.

    I am just saying that I am *extremely* offended that they changed the main character representations of justice of will and jack from the source material so much from being incorruptible main characters following the law to those in the tv show of being so pathetic and weak that they choose to break laws and try to murder people to solve their perceived problems.

    There are no MAIN characters that are good (characters who don't try to murder people to solve their perceived problems) this is a significant contrast to the source material.

    In the source material, jack and will never try to murder, and are consistent in this sense. In the tv show, during season 2, at a certain point, each of them try to murder which is inconsistent from season 1 where they don't try to murder. Thus the characters of will and jack in the source material are consistent and the characters of will and jack in the tv show are inconsistent

    inconsistent means acting at variance with one's own principles or former conduct.

    the source material contrasted will, the incorruptible law enforcement of justice, with hannibal, who murders people he perceives to be rude, with a main message that people who are able to think about bad stuff can choose to protect people like will instead of murder people like Hannibal.

    if this is not the main message of the source material, then I am less sophisticated and more stupid than average.

    however, it is now possible, although it is AT THE VERY WORST, that the tv show is now seeming to contrasting will, the corrupt law enforcement who try's to murders people in the name of justice (again, there is now no main character in the tv show who does not try to murder people), with hannibal, who murders people he perceives to be rude, with a seeming main message that society has changed so much since the time of the source material that it is now more "human" for people who are able to think about bad stuff who try to protect people will just end up trying to murder people anyway just as hannibal murders people and hannibal will always win because he is more experienced at it so there is no point trying to protect people rather than murder them. else there is no point to simultaneously have jack and will try to murder and have no main good characters who don't try to murder. obviously, this is not the intended or even reasonable message of the show. another possibility is that the source material had a point it had a good guy/gal, but the tv show does not have a good guy/gal and it does not have such a simple point, it is just an artistic and beautiful way to present the most ugly horrifying and shocking to showcase talent of those involved in making the project. this paragraph is an over-exaggerated and offensive to illustrate a point.

    the way the tv show has changed this aspect of the story from the source material deeply offends me in the way the previous paragraph is offensive.

    for the characters of will and jack to live and for them to triumph over hannibal instead of a truly good incorruptible character triumphing over hannibal would be irresponsible and would desecrate the source material even more.

    jack and will have lost ALL credibility to represent justice.

    all I am saying is the show might be getting dangerously close to being an encouragement for potential murders.

    murder should not be tolerated. murder should not be encouraged.

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  69. DarthLocke4May 26, 2014 at 1:56 PM

    "are you saying there is a debate in the fictional tv show on whether murders are more human and more fit for survival than non-murders?"


    Yes and No.


    What I'm saying is that there's a debate about "what" humanity really is, spiritually elevated human beings or animals that pretend to be something we're not.


    Hannibal represents a dichotomy between primal animal and the enlightened being.


    If one where in a literary analysis class, one would have to explore what Hannibal was really about and it's not just about a serial killer and how to catch him, but a serial killer with a specific set of ideals, who longs to have the perfect relationship with someone else out of loss, because loss makes us feel like we need to take "control" of our lives and that is what Hannibal does, but in addition he tries to also make "champions" out of others too.


    In the TV Show Randall Tier is a good example of what I'm trying to say. There are 3 main reasons Randall was killed...
    1. To have Hannibal give Will the present he thought Will wanted (to kill someone else)


    2. The be "even Steven" with Will for sending Brown after Hannibal.


    3. Hannibal deemed that Randal went as high in Randall's "evolution" as Hannibal thought possible, which is also OPPOSITE to Hannibal's own ideals. Randall was an animal who often randomly killed or should I say ripped people to shreds like an animal.


    Even though this will be rather different in the TV show (which I have a theory as to how), than in the books, Hannibal's origin story in the novel Hannibal Rising is born out of WAR, as he his family and his family's castle is caught between Russia and Germany in WWII. Again Thomas Harris creates a Eugenicist (Hannibal) out of a Eugenics movement (Nazi Germany/ pre-Cold War Russia) to solidify this debate about people killing people, which is extended through Hannibal's breif mentioning of his ancestry: Teutonic Knights (and Lady Murasaki's ancestry -samurais!)--your "clan of bears" so to speak...

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  70. george257May 26, 2014 at 3:26 PM

    someone who murders is a bad person, REGARDLESS of whatever life events *made* that person CHOOSE to murder, regardless of how much the person looks or acts like a good person.

    I agree that the character of hannibal is well done in the tv show, perhaps done better than the source material.

    however the other characters, such as will and jack are done much worse in the tv show.

    Alana is not innocent, she *intended* to shoot hannibal, and followed through on her intention twice. Alana is bad not good.

    Alana intended to shoot hannibal in the finale when she did not know she did not have bullets, she was not under threat, this was not self defense, she is a vigilante attempting murder. What is even worse is that when she got bullets, she shot through a door assuming it was the person she wanted to shoot, she failed to visually identify her target, it could have been anyone.

    Soldiers are the very best of good people because they choose to protect and serve and risk their lives for the rest of us.

    hannibal is clearly not a soldier.

    The tv show does not have any good main characters. This is not reality.

    Mathematically and statistically the majority of people are not murderers, not the product of ware, not mentally disturbed.

    Sure hannibal gets away with it in the story, but because the tv show changed the story so that there are no main characters who are good trying to stop him, it is like the tv show is saying that people who are good and follow laws to try to stop bad guys don't matter at all or have all become extinct in the last two decades.

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  71. DarthLocke4May 26, 2014 at 5:49 PM

    "someone who murders is a bad person, REGARDLESS of whatever life events *made* that person CHOOSE to murder, regardless of how much the person looks or acts like a good person."


    That's your OPINION! Humanity has been fighting for centuries trying to decide what is "the best way to live" and for what purpose are we living. Culture is PROOF of humanities struggle with our own existence, as it changes from place to place and time to time and as many wars have been fought about these things. That is what Harris and Fuller's version looks at. This struggle and SUBJECTIVITY and/or Empiricism of human existenceor reality, as experiences (both natural and nuturing) shape us to become what we become, and IMO stepping outside of the work for moment to express my own beliefs, , as a society that I think would like to move past these things, has to care about that and not just label what we don't like or understand as "good or bad".


    People murder sometimes as self defense and/or people who are abused in some way, become violent to seek their own justice, which even our own justice system fails...and "Hannibal" novel also aptly points out.

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  72. george257May 26, 2014 at 9:09 PM

    I am talking only about murder not homicide in general.

    murder is different from self defense

    murder is different from manslaughter

    murder is different from homicide

    murder is different from lawful killing

    murder is different from lawful killing in war...

    from wiki, "Murder is the unlawful killing, with malice aforethought, of another human, and generally this premeditated state of mind distinguishes murder from other forms of unlawful homicide (such as manslaughter)."

    please note the terms malice and premeditated

    from mw dictionary malice is defined as "desire to cause pain, injury, or distress to another, intent to commit an unlawful act or cause harm without legal justification or excuse"

    from mw dictionary bad is defined " morally objectionable", "injurious, harmful"

    you seem to be saying that murder is not morally objectionable and not injurious harmful. are you saying that if you were the person being murdered, you would not object on moral grounds and that you think you were being harmed. really? please tell me I am misunderstanding you.

    literally minutes after the hannibal finale aired on the east coast, Elliot Rodger murdered six people near UC Santa Barbara. It is certain this was murder, not self defense.

    Please help me understand why you might consider Elliot Rodger a good person.

    perhaps you are in an argumentation class and have homework of arguing a deplorable and unpopular position.

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  73. DarthLocke4May 26, 2014 at 10:56 PM

    Somewhat true, but again like many things are words that are subject to definition, as any kind of killing and justice of killing is defined by what a culture is morally willing to and unwilling to accept. In a modern context in a first world country that has separation of religion and state, you are accurate. But even "lawful" killing again relies on what any given culture sets as a law or lawful. In some places lawful killing includes hanging, cutting off people's hands, ect.(things that would be considered "immoral" elsewhere/elsewhen.


    But again this is a work of Fiction in which looks at subjectivity of reality ("psychological thriller"). I think most of us have to put our beliefs aside when we watch tv, films, plays, read books, ect, because otherwise, I don't think there would be a lot of things to entertain ourselves with and/or philosophically be willing to consider otherwise.


    I can understand and empathize with where Hannibal is coming from. I can feel for him, admire his better qualities, even though In real life I would never want to attempt a relationship with such a person. That's the point of most works, because most characters are immoral to someone else, it's just we all draw the lines of acceptance at different places depending on what any one of us thinks morality is or should be.


    But I'm finished with this conversation. If you have a problem with the show and it's characters, then you can just not watch it. It's easy.

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  74. george257May 26, 2014 at 11:51 PM

    I thought the show is set in the US. I thought most all main characters shown are born and raised in the US.

    For the tv show to change them into so easily resorting to murder seems to be the shows comment about the change in culture and morals in the US. Things are so much better in the US in the past 20 years, it does not make any sense for the main characters to become intended murders.

    Hannibal being born in Lithuania and growing up in France exposed to harsh environment etc. explains things about Hannibals actions and his view on morality, but not all of the other main characters.

    I did not have a serious problem with the show until the finale of season 2 when the show turned ALL of the main characters who are suppose to be good guys into bad guys (people who choose to murder to solve their problems).

    I understand it is impossible to make everyone happy, and that some people will stop watching regardless of which story choices are made, but is it really so much to ask for at least one main character who is incorruptible who will never choose murder to solve their problems?

    In the source material there is jack, will, clarice. The tv show has already made it so that alana, abigail, will, and jack are all corrupt attempted murders.

    what is the show going to do next, change clarice into a corrupt murder too?

    I understand that different people come from different cultures and have different views on morality and I understand why there main characters who have the view that murder and corruption is ok, I just don't understand why there are no main characters with integrity and fortitude to be incorruptible and follow the rules.

    The problem with not watching is that the show has blurred open-ended hooks that may or not pay off.

    For example, the hook in the first episode of season 2 of the fight between jack and hannibal did not pay off in two senses. First we dont see what happens to jack afterward. Second, jacks actions and his reason why he was there reveals that he tried to murder hannibal in cold blood, so that now jack has no credibility as being a reasonable representation of justice.

    The only reason that got me through that will locked up instead of Hannibal nonsense is that hook.

    Depending on what happens in the beginning of season 3, I might stop watching the show.

    Ok, lets not discuss this anymore.

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  75. DarthLocke4May 27, 2014 at 12:37 AM

    It is mostly set in the US, but that doesn't mean that the US is necessarily "right" or moral about how it conducts it's laws, as even law enforcement can be political, prejudice, and come with some type of corruptibility, it's just more over, given Hannibal and Hannibal Rising, that the story of Hannibal is about challenging any given viewpoint on social justice and what humanity is, as all of the continuous ANIMAL motifs and allusions are there to ask if humans are just animals with big ideas or not. It goes outside the purview of "modern" social justice to just simply as what justice is, when Hannibal is also a victim too!

    Hannibal takes place in the US and Italy, Hannibal Rising takes place in Lithunia, France, but also features Eastern Philosophy through Hannibal's relationship with his Japanese Aunt, Red Dragon and Silence take place in the US, but Hannibal is not a full fledged character in those two works, because he is limited and "behind bars"...

    You don't have to kill to be a bad person either, some believe that are fates worse than death and/or degrees of death also matter in terms of justice (ei Murder in the first, second, or third degree are tried different).

    They are Bad guys to you, but not bad guys to me. They're just a little broken, because unlike the novels they have very heavy emotional things going on, which again feeds into Hannibal's?Harris presentation of the human primal argument.

    And by the way Murder is actually used often as a slang turn to mean, anyone who takes someone else's life...so Manslaughter, Homicide, self defense, ect are different types of murder.

    Please see "Killings of others" section: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_types_of_killing

    Alana is innocent. She came with a gun, because she wanted to protect herself, Jack, and Will, which as it turns out, because she refused to leave, she was threatened with her life by Hannibal. It was all out of self defence

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  76. george257May 27, 2014 at 2:11 AM

    Perhaps murder is slang for what you say. But it certainly is not in any way self defense. And certainly none of them are innocent, they know the laws, they know better.


    Think of it objectively from hannibals point of view.


    At no time does Hannibal in any way prevent her from leaving, he does not run at her, he does not use a gun, he does not even touch her, he does not come anywhere near her, she does not eve see jack, hannibal tells her to get out of his house she is not welcome she is trespassing and to get out of his house or he will kill her, which is his legal right. Alana is free to leave, call the proper authorities, report that hannibal and get a restraining order if she felt in danger. (Jack and will could also got a restraining order.) Trying to shoot and murder hannibal is not in any way self defense. But Alana (as well as jack and will) who all have no legal authority chose to go where hannibal was and threaten him with a gun then intended to shoot him and kill him.

    None of them are innocent especially Alana.

    They are, all three of them, alana jack and will, by definition, vigilantes.

    A vigilante is a member of a self-appointed group that undertakes law enforcement without legal authority.

    They are the aggressors, if anything, hannibal is defending himself from people trying to murder him.

    The filmmakers are extremely clever but when looked at objectively, hannibal is the ONLY one using self defense, and well within his legal rights, in fact, if he wanted to, hannibal could have not cut abigail, but instead made sure the three die, then stay in the us and file a lawsuit for injuries hannibal sustained while being attacked by those three criminals vigilante attempted murders. Now, this is taking into account the possibility that the three called the authorities BEFORE they entered his house.


    There is no logical sense for hannibal to cut abigails throat, even to hurt will. There are much more effective ways of hurting will more deeply, why not have abigail be the one that stabs will in the back, then will turns around and shoots abigail on reflex thinking it is hannibal, and immediately regrets it when abigail tells him hannibal said if she did not stab will in the back, hannibal would, and she might be forced to eat will or watch him die???


    And abigail being stabbed is not set up properly, it is sloppy. It is like an alternate ending that got put in at very last minute.


    by this choice of hannibal cutting abigail, the writers have forced hannibal to flee, because cutting abigail is the ONLY thing he does wrong which can be proved and cannot be cleaned up before authorities arrive since her blood is mixed with wills blood.


    Even abigail is not innocent, she could have not tried to murder alana instead got her to rescue her by taking her car, for that matter abigail could have warned will hannibal was behind him sooner, and will would have shot hannibal to save abigail, again abigail is the only evidence whatsovever of criminal behavor of hannibal as hannibal and will already burned and destroyed all other traces of evidence.


    rembember abigails word and the fact that hannibal failed to disclose that abigail could not have been killed by will because hannibal could product her living self is more than enough to convict hannibal of at the very least kidnapping her


    Most tellingly is that after abigail pushes alana out the window alana clearly drops the gun right next to abigail so abigail could have picked up the gun and shot hannibal herself, that would be an example of self defense.


    However, abigail chose hannibal no less than those four times just mentioned when she could have escaped.


    abigail is certainly not innocent.


    where is the 7 year plan.

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  77. DarthLocke4May 27, 2014 at 2:33 PM

    Hannibal specifically says to her that either she leaves or he will kill her...he tells Abigail to push her out the window, and she does. (He a coconspirator to murder)


    the definition of a Vigilanti relies on what one deems "justice" as, again "Laws" are cultural acceptances, not necessarily the true nature of reality and not necessarily morally correct, as morals rely on what one believes one's purpose for living and dying is, as some people deem GOD or GODS the judge of humanity, not law enforcement.



    A restraining order would not catch Hannibal. Will in Red Dragon was very lucky to have caught him...but once we get to the end of Silence of Lambs and into Hannibal, it becomes clear that Hannibal is one the most hardest people to catch on the planet, as he is never caught by law enforcement again.


    But seriously, George, I think you just need to watch a different show like Blue Bloods or something. It's clearly not for you. This is now my last post to you. If you want to talk about works of fiction and your acceptance and lack there of in a belief that TV should have to reflect a perfect law enforcement and where all criminals a kilelrs are simply bad people, you'll have to find someone else to do it with.

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  78. GraydonMay 27, 2014 at 4:06 PM

    Well except Will who catches him.

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  79. DarthLocke4May 30, 2014 at 2:05 AM

    The Hannibal novel themes are: Romance, punishment and retribution, and CORRUPTION!l

    Please see wikipedia Hannibal under "Themes" if you do not believe me:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hannibal_(film)

    The beginning of both the film and novel deal with Clarice being UNJUSTLY blamed by her own colleagues for the the drug raid going wrong. Both Inspector Pazzi and the former pencil pushing Paul Krendler sell out their integrity to Mason Verger and are corrupted law enforcement. In the novel, as he is not in the film version, Jack Crawford basically roles over on his former wife's side of the bed and dies from a heart attack. He doesn't protect Clarice nor does he go looking for her when she is missing. Clarice is temped to be corrupted in the film version, but doesn't become so, but in the novel she does, as she accepts and stays with Hannibal for 3 years!!!!

    In Hannibal Rising these themes surface again, as we both have the juxtaposition of Lithuania once being apart of Germany, but now prior to WII Independant, caught in between the Nazi's and Russians...but even furthured by the fact that LOCAL lithuanians are hired to become Nazi HS, and use this title to pilfer, raid, and sell all of Lecter Castles family possessions along with eating Mischa in front of Hannibal! --So again there's this idea both immediate and historic that people turn on there "own" people all the time...even the nod back to the Teutonic Knights/Order play again to a "crusade" being fought in the name of many unjust and often corruptible things! So the fact that the Red Dragon characters now share in that corruptibility only solidifies and connects those characters to the more important and climatic source material!!!!!

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  80. george257May 31, 2014 at 4:49 AM

    I am talking about characters in the tv show that are also in source material. I am not talking about tv shows in general. I am not talking about characters in general.

    in the books will does not become corrupt. in the film adaptions will does not become corrupt. however, in the tv show will has become corrupt .

    in the books jack does not become corrupt. in the film adaptions jack does not become corrupt. however, in the tv show jack has become corrupt.

    all main characters in the tv show has become corrupt, and the tv show considers incorruptible main characters as not being important.

    the effect is that the main theme of the tv show is significantly different from the source material

    the overall theme in the source material, those who fight evil don't have to become evil themselves in order to defeat evil so it is more important to defeat evil without becoming evil since if those who fight evil must become evil to defeat that evil, they have not defeated evil at all, they have just replaced it. in the source material will defeats Hannibal twice and neither time turns to evil to do it.

    the overall theme in the tv show seems to be that it is that those who fight evil become cannot help becoming evil themselves and still cannot defeat evil so it is more important join evil rather than fight evil since those who try to fight evil will just end up becoming an inferior evil that wont survive the fight against evil.



    the tv show is not honoring the source material. they said they would, but they have not. will and jack, the main characters has been significantly dishonored lacking integrity lowered down to hannibal level, and the main theme has changed significantly.


    I hope they don't get any more of the rights to the source material the don't already have, I don't want them to get their hands on clarice, they would just dishonor her character like they have done with will and jack.

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  81. george257May 31, 2014 at 5:43 AM

    will gram is in the source material

    the source material and tv show are very different

    look at it this way: hannibal is #1 villain from 1903-2003 AFI's 100 Years...100 Heroes & Villains and clarice starling is the #6 hero, each from silence. in silence, Clarice is not corrupted in any way and does not become evil to defeat it.



    so what made it so iconic is the contrast, the comparison of true hero and true villain the fight of hero and villain, of good and evil.


    by making jack and will significantly less heroic and more like villains, and having not a single true hero in the tv show to contrast and fight hannibal it not only significantly diminishes hannibal into being such a much less effective villain it also turns the fight into inept evil pretending to be good vs true evil which is far less compelling than true good vs true evil.


    in effect it makes the story irrelevant since what happens to the characters doesn't matter because they are so inconsistent in the tv show and so inconsistent from what they are the source material.


    so the only reason to watch is that it visually looks great and sounds great. the story and characters have been trashed beyond repair and don't matter.


    like a great painting that is visually stimulating because of its colors are nice and what the painting is of or why it is painted does not matter.


    like a great song that is great only because of its beat and melody and instruments, but its lyrics don't matter.


    those who stopped watching it was because its story and character changes are terrible.


    those who continue watch are doing so mostly because the show looks and sounds great, but not so much to see how the story and characters are developed because the story and characters are nothing like the source material, unless, they disliked the heroes that refused to become corrupt and thought that it is more important to take those heroes out of the story and have all corrupt main characters.


    sort of like re-watching avatar because it visually looks good and it sounds good, not because the story or characters are anything new, or even improvements on already used story or characters.

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  82. DarthLocke4May 31, 2014 at 12:56 PM

    I don't think that you have ever read any of the novels, because corruption is a theme, especially in the last two works published, as there is an element of a Faustian. Like I said, Molly Foster, Will Graham's wife, does NOT like Jack Crawford, because it's suggested that Jaack used Will and put Will in harms way, thus Jack Crawford to her was not a good person. Since our show is currently a prequel to Red Dragon, we are now seeing the corruptibility 'bloom', because this is what happens when one makes deals with the devil--again a theme of the material, as it is post modern Faustian.

    ""Hannibal at eighteen was rooting for Mephistopheles and contemptuous of Faust, but he only half-listened to the climax. He was watching and breathing Lady Murasaki..." -Hannibal Rising"

    "
    Molly Foster Graham is Will Graham's wife. She is the same height asWill, five feet ten inches. She runs a dress shop and has a "good ramshackle house on Sugarloaf Key" (an island in the lower Florida Keys). She is very protective of Will and doesn't like Jack Crawford."
    Molly Foster Character Guide: http://reddragonspoilers.blogspot.com/2012/09/molly-foster-graham.html

    Again in Hannibal (the novel) Jack does not really help Clarice, as Clarice takes the blame for something that isn't her fault, which is furthered by Jack not going to look for her at the end of the novel, as his grief about his wife and other things leads to his heart attack (three yrs after the 7 year gap, I might add) and he dies. Will Graham now reflects certain aspects of Clarice, while also using Time and "Stephen Hawking" like ideas as apart of his character (those ideas are highlighted in the novel Hannibal, but through Clarice's experience instead, as opposed to an ability Will has).

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  83. george257May 31, 2014 at 6:32 PM

    just because someone does not like someone else does not make them a bad person and does not make them corrupt engaging in behavior they know to be illegal.

    will and jack never do this in the source material but they do in the tv show.

    if you have read all the novels and also have not been able come up with any examples of this, then in effect you are agreeing with me.

    jack has been fully exploited and dishonored by the tv show. shame on them for dishonoring the tv show this much.

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  84. DarthLocke4June 1, 2014 at 12:32 AM

    http://www.spoilertv.com/2014/05/hannibal-bryan-fullers-metamorphisis.html

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