I liked the episode - "Not Moose" hahahaha. I loved all of the Sam and Crowley dialogue. I was really excited when I thought that Sam would finally get to save Dean -- too bad, they had such a nice set up for it. But giving Dean a myth arc is turning out well. I can't wait to see more of the emotional fallout the First Blade will cause Dean to have.
And they messed with Metallicar --- they are so dead. Really keying the Impala?
Snooki's cameo was great. I liked it better than I thought it would.
Love where they're taking Dean, but the brothers really need to make up. And holy shit, I thought they took Metallicar's doors off for some reason - so glad the car is fine (other than being keyed, that is).
Awesome, Awesome and Awesome!!! OMG if i was worried before about what the Mark of cain would do to dean, now I'm terrified!!! Jensen did a great job and Crowley...Not moose I was laughing so much. I can't believe they messe up with Dean's baby. Abbadon you are so dead right now.
Setting up Sam to save Dean but in the end it was Dean who saved him was not cool. So was they showing Dean killing the vampire easy and Sam puffing and get bitten. We got it writers, Sam is an awful hunter and Dean is a so awesome one.
And I know I'm going to get a ton of thumbs down, but here it is: I think Jensen is really overdoing his batman voice, to the point it could get cringsworthy. If Dark!Dean means he is getting it deeper so he will not speak anymore. He will growl. And I thought he was OTT when he got the blade, and this coming for a Jensen fan. I didn't like his acting choices there.
I'm more excited about the next episode because I really like MoL stories. But putting Sam again in the damzel in distress position is not cool.
Well . . . it's not clear what the MOC is doing to Dean so it's hard to judge JA's acting choices right now. At the end, he seemed enraged. Maybe he's being overwhelmed w/feelings of hatred? I guess we'll find out!
Oh, I agree that that was the point of the Crowley arc, but they spent next to no time on it so they should have just dropped it, IMO. No offense to Charlie/Garth fans (and I like Garth), but instead of wasting time on Charlie going to Oz or Garth being a werewolf, they could have spent some time developing this human blood addiction thing so the audience would be invested in it. I hate when an arc is wrapped up in one episode like Sam's hallucinations in S7. That's just bad storytelling, IMO.
I agree about the pacing too. And that scene where that woman was hitting on Dean so hard, I was expecting another kind of exchange between two brothers that are supposed to be business partners, not the usual Dean showing off little smile and Sam annoyed with the situation smile. I seriously expected Dean smiling to Sam and the younger Winchester all about the case, not even caring about it.
I also found it a bit slow and I was sort of confused by Magnus and his entire set-up. I doubt we'll ever see it explored again (or the magic he was using) though.
Yeah . . . I liked that scene btw the woman and Dean, but you could see these writers weren't interested in whatever conflict the boys are currently in b/c they flat out ignored it. The boys acted perfectly normal here, and if I didn't know better, I would think they were fine w/each other. That shouldn't be the case.
Was this the one with Snooki? If so, what was her point? I dunno if I'll watch it. I've been losing the will to watch anymore of this season. At least until the finale.
I wasn't aware that was a drama statement. I don't care if Snooki was on the show, I don't think she ruined it by any stretch. It's as a whole, the back half of the season's been grating me. Like a lot of others. So I'm gonna pick and choose which eps I watch at least until the season finale.
Sometimes it's tough to tell what's grating a lot of others because fans have been complaining about SPN from the time I started following online fan stuff with it. For instance, at the time most people hated season 3, hated season 4, hated season 6, hated season 7, hated season 5. Last season almost everyone hated the first half of season 8. Then other people hated the second half. Rinse and repeat for this season.
You might want to try to watch some of the mark of Cain parts of this. The rest was OK, nothing you'd really miss.
I think she publicly commented about the amount of hate that she was getting from the fans because of her cameo, and this was before the episode even aired. That's a damn shame, especially as she was only on screen for about a minute and did fine. I hope the actions of those 'fans' won't sour her to the experience she actually had on the show.
But Crowley's blood addiction was spoiled during the summer. They acted like this was going to be a character arc for him, and it wasn't. And then they spent the majority of the episode on this addiction that he says he's over at the end of the episode, so why even go there w/him? That's my problem.
Everything doesn't have to mirror something else. Just tell the story.
I think it was a character arc, in a sense. We saw him struggling and craving, saw moments of vulnerability (he seemed really desperate to get Sam's approval in this episode, for instance), and we may continue to see them.
It's not a big story, but I prefer it to the role he usually has (mustache-twirling or just playing everyone).
She did comment on it, and while the episode aired she retweeted some of the hate she got. It's a shame because I know she got positive comments too. It's easy to overlook those when people tweet things like wishing you'd gotten punched.
I was undecided whether I wanted to watch this episode or not, and in the end I didn't. x
I'm fed up watching episodes hoping that the quality of the writing and the plot lines improve, and that the brothers are written as they should be, but each time coming away unsatisfied. x
So what I did was watch Croatoan instead, one of my favourite episodes and I came away eminently satisfied. x
I will stay with Sam and Dean until the end but it's strange that watching current episodes of my favourite show should make me feel more unhappy than happy. Go figure. x
I just wish Carver and co. had never got their uncaring hands on the franchise, but unfortunately they have, and have turned the 'little show that could' into a run-of-the-mill urban fantasy, pushing to the side the one unique thing that has kept the show going for nine years, the wonderful, charismatic, unhealthy brother bond. :(
Does anybody know if Magnus' "Invisible house" was the same house they used as Jared's mansion back in Season 6's "The French Mistake"? It looked really similar.
They might be trying to draw a parallel to how the trials affected Sam. Magnus did say something like you get used to it the more you use it. There is only one Abaddon.
I liked this episode and I'm surprised that there have been three good episodes in a row now. It was interesting to watch Crowley at the end. It was almost like he was waiting for Dean to kill Sam or to see if Dean would kill Sam. Dean killed another human being. Wonder how many more humans he'll kill with that mark? Dark Dean is really dark because he's killing humans, but supposedly Dark Sam drinking demon blood killed demons. Sad part is, Dean has wanted to kill how many people long before he got that mark. Gordon, Bela and Max come to mind. He probably would have killed all three of them if Sam had not been around.
Hmmm . . . that's an interesting idea, but I'm thinking his desire for human blood stems from the trials and the feeling he got from it. But he could have been faking the addiction. Who knows?
Ehh . . . I need more than a single episode for a character arc. The entire thing was resolved last night so I'm not sure why they wasted time w/it. The first 40 minutes of the show felt like filler.
I think you would enjoy this episode if you watched it - it was one of the episodes where I thought they actually seemed like brothers and Sam really cared about Dean.
Even so, it's confusing to the viewer that in a string of episodes, we have the brothers at odds with each other with Sam saying hurtful things that obviously affect Dean, and then magically in certain scenes, it's as if those moments never happened. x A story has to be told logically, with a beginning, an evolution and an ending. Here the brother relationship jumps about, one writer putting it out one way and another giving their own take. It's confusing and unpleasant to watch. x Why can't the writers give us a few scenes where the brothers really talk to one another and hash out their problems once and for all; problems that have already been repeatedly adressed in previous seasons anyway; but as Carver is determined to keep the brothers at loggerheads, he could at least give them some face-to -face time to let them AND us understand exactly what they are thinking. These are the main characters of the show, their problems deserve more care and attention. x One or two random scenes where the brothers actually remember they are brothers and treat each other accordingly isn't enough. It just doesn't come over as real. X I always remember the little opening scene in 'Sam Interrupted' where the brothers tell the truth about themselves; what they do, and their relationship, and they do so knowing they won't be taken seriously but considered crazy. I loved that scene.
Agreed. No show has really touched my heartstrings as has the saga of these two broken,courageous and unfortunate brothers and as long as both are on the show together, I'll hang on to them.
Violation possession has not be a issue before. I realize alot of the fandom want it all brushed under the carpet and that Sam has been unreasonable over the whole thing. However Dean created the situation not Sam's words and unless that is acknowledged then I do not want Sam just giving up and Dean gets away with it again.
Hi. I presume you're referring to this phrase. 'Sam saying hurtful things that obviously affect Dean'.
I mentioned that because I was talking about the current episodes, but IMO what Dean said to Sam in season eight about Benny being a better brother than Sam has ever been is far worse; it's the most hurtful thing Dean could have said to Sam. T he brothers hurt each other equally on a regular basis, unfortunately.. x
Having said that I believe Dean acted perfectly in character with what he did. He has always tried to save his brother at all costs, and if Ezekiel hadn't answered, then Dean would have had no other option than to watch Sam die; but Ezekiel did answer, so Dean took the opportunity that was offered to him to keep Sam alive.
Where Dean made the mistake, in my opinion was that he didn't tell Sam afterwards, and I believe that's what is upsetting Sam most, the fact that Dean kept what he'd done a secret. x
I completely agree though that the show is about two brothers, both fascinating characters, both should be treated equally and given ample opportunity to share their thoughts and feeling with us the viewers.
Can we be sure Magnus is dead? Or was just another shapeshifter killed? And since nobody really dies on the show..........who knows we might get to see Magnus and his invisible Fortress again, next season.
I thought this episode was okay. The pacing was really bad, in my opinion. For me, the episode didn't pick up until S&D were sitting down and talking to that guy. Nothing else that occurred in the episode had any purpose. Even Crowley's blood addiction seems to have ended, which begs the question: What was the point of that arc?
I did enjoy the scenes w/Dean holding the Blade, and I'm interested to see what it does to him. He was clearly affected by it and seemed to go into a trance of sorts at the end. This should be interesting.
I did find it strange that the tension/angst btw the brother was virtually forgotten. That lack of consistency is not good, IMO.
I think Jensen did a good job of showing how the blade just took Dean out of his mind and body completely. He was totally overcome.
By recent season standards I actually thought this episode had a smart Sam. Yes he was captured at the end, but he got back inside on his own and he killed two of the thugs. Dean had to save him, but he was also a big distraction so Dean would be able to free himself.
I think the point of the blood addiction arc was to show Crowley struggling with who he is, as Dean and Cas have also been doing. I'm also not too sure it's completely over.
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I liked the episode - "Not Moose" hahahaha. I loved all of the Sam and Crowley dialogue. I was really excited when I thought that Sam would finally get to save Dean -- too bad, they had such a nice set up for it. But giving Dean a myth arc is turning out well. I can't wait to see more of the emotional fallout the First Blade will cause Dean to have.
ReplyDeleteAnd they messed with Metallicar --- they are so dead. Really keying the Impala?
Snooki's cameo was great. I liked it better than I thought it would.
ReplyDeleteLove where they're taking Dean, but the brothers really need to make up. And holy shit, I thought they took Metallicar's doors off for some reason - so glad the car is fine (other than being keyed, that is).
Good episode!
These two writers needs to stop.
ReplyDeleteThe episode was good?
ReplyDeleteAwesome, Awesome and Awesome!!! OMG if i was worried before about what the Mark of cain would do to dean, now I'm terrified!!! Jensen did a great job and Crowley...Not moose I was laughing so much. I can't believe they messe up with Dean's baby. Abbadon you are so dead right now.
ReplyDeleteAwesome episode...... Was far beyond what I expected.
ReplyDeleteAwesome episode..... Was far beyond what I expected.
ReplyDeleteGood episode.
ReplyDeleteSetting up Sam to save Dean but in the end it was Dean who saved him was not cool. So was they showing Dean killing the vampire easy and Sam puffing and get bitten. We got it writers, Sam is an awful hunter and Dean is a so awesome one.
And I know I'm going to get a ton of thumbs down, but here it is: I think Jensen is really overdoing his batman voice, to the point it could get cringsworthy. If Dark!Dean means he is getting it deeper so he will not speak anymore. He will growl. And I thought he was OTT when he got the blade, and this coming for a Jensen fan. I didn't like his acting choices there.
I'm more excited about the next episode because I really like MoL stories. But putting Sam again in the damzel in distress position is not cool.
I thought the doors had been removed too! Haha!
ReplyDeleteWell . . . it's not clear what the MOC is doing to Dean so it's hard to judge JA's acting choices right now. At the end, he seemed enraged. Maybe he's being overwhelmed w/feelings of hatred? I guess we'll find out!
ReplyDeleteGlad I wasn't alone in thinking that!
ReplyDeleteOh, I agree that that was the point of the Crowley arc, but they spent next to no time on it so they should have just dropped it, IMO. No offense to Charlie/Garth fans (and I like Garth), but instead of wasting time on Charlie going to Oz or Garth being a werewolf, they could have spent some time developing this human blood addiction thing so the audience would be invested in it. I hate when an arc is wrapped up in one episode like Sam's hallucinations in S7. That's just bad storytelling, IMO.
ReplyDeleteI agree about the pacing too. And that scene where that woman was hitting on Dean so hard, I was expecting another kind of exchange between two brothers that are supposed to be business partners, not the usual Dean showing off little smile and Sam annoyed with the situation smile. I seriously expected Dean smiling to Sam and the younger Winchester all about the case, not even caring about it.
ReplyDeleteYou're being kind telling it is a bad storytelling. It's awful.
ReplyDeleteI also found it a bit slow and I was sort of confused by Magnus and his entire set-up. I doubt we'll ever see it explored again (or the magic he was using) though.
ReplyDeleteYeah . . . I liked that scene btw the woman and Dean, but you could see these writers weren't interested in whatever conflict the boys are currently in b/c they flat out ignored it. The boys acted perfectly normal here, and if I didn't know better, I would think they were fine w/each other. That shouldn't be the case.
ReplyDeleteHaha :-)
ReplyDeleteSam better watch out, he almost showed emotional concern for Dean
ReplyDeleteCue to awful storytelling.
ReplyDelete"And I know I'm going to get a ton of thumbs down"
ReplyDeleteIt's pointless for anyone to thumbs down anymore. Disqus doesn't show them on the page now.
Was this the one with Snooki? If so, what was her point? I dunno if I'll watch it. I've been losing the will to watch anymore of this season. At least until the finale.
ReplyDeleteOh my god, stop the drama. That was just a special participation.
ReplyDeleteI wasn't aware that was a drama statement. I don't care if Snooki was on the show, I don't think she ruined it by any stretch. It's as a whole, the back half of the season's been grating me. Like a lot of others. So I'm gonna pick and choose which eps I watch at least until the season finale.
ReplyDeleteI think it was just a fun little stunt casting bit, like Paris Hilton a few years ago. She was a crossroads demon.
ReplyDeleteSometimes it's tough to tell what's grating a lot of others because fans have been complaining about SPN from the time I started following online fan stuff with it. For instance, at the time most people hated season 3, hated season 4, hated season 6, hated season 7, hated season 5. Last season almost everyone hated the first half of season 8. Then other people hated the second half. Rinse and repeat for this season.
ReplyDeleteYou might want to try to watch some of the mark of Cain parts of this. The rest was OK, nothing you'd really miss.
Was it not Crowley who freed Dean?
ReplyDeleteYeah you're right. Sorry. Still, same purpose.
ReplyDeleteAnd she's apparently a fan of the show.
ReplyDeleteI think she publicly commented about the amount of hate that she was getting from the fans because of her cameo, and this was before the episode even aired. That's a damn shame, especially as she was only on screen for about a minute and did fine. I hope the actions of those 'fans' won't sour her to the experience she actually had on the show.
ReplyDeleteShe didn't have a point. Nothing important happened until the 9:42 or so mark of the episode.
ReplyDeleteBut Crowley's blood addiction was spoiled during the summer. They acted like this was going to be a character arc for him, and it wasn't. And then they spent the majority of the episode on this addiction that he says he's over at the end of the episode, so why even go there w/him? That's my problem.
ReplyDeleteEverything doesn't have to mirror something else. Just tell the story.
I think it was a character arc, in a sense. We saw him struggling and craving, saw moments of vulnerability (he seemed really desperate to get Sam's approval in this episode, for instance), and we may continue to see them.
ReplyDeleteIt's not a big story, but I prefer it to the role he usually has (mustache-twirling or just playing everyone).
She did comment on it, and while the episode aired she retweeted some of the hate she got. It's a shame because I know she got positive comments too. It's easy to overlook those when people tweet things like wishing you'd gotten punched.
ReplyDeleteYeah I did also. Keying was bad enough but at least they still have the doors. ;)
ReplyDeleteI was undecided whether I wanted to watch this episode or not, and in the end I didn't.
ReplyDeletex
I'm fed up watching episodes hoping that the quality of the writing and the plot lines improve, and that the brothers are written as they should be, but each time coming away unsatisfied.
x
So what I did was watch Croatoan instead, one of my favourite episodes and I came away eminently satisfied.
x
I will stay with Sam and Dean until the end but it's strange that watching current episodes of my favourite show should make me feel more unhappy than happy. Go figure.
x
I just wish Carver and co. had never got their uncaring hands on the franchise, but unfortunately they have, and have turned the 'little show that could' into a run-of-the-mill urban fantasy, pushing to the side the one unique thing that has kept the show going for nine years, the wonderful, charismatic, unhealthy brother bond. :(
Does anybody know if Magnus' "Invisible house" was the same house they used as Jared's mansion back in Season 6's "The French Mistake"? It looked really similar.
ReplyDeleteThat was one of the best episodes of the series.
ReplyDeleteDon't know why they didn't go back in Magnus' house and grab all the stuff they could.
Maybe Crowley set the blood addiction thing up himself so he would end up with the blade.
ReplyDeleteThey might be trying to draw a parallel to how the trials affected Sam. Magnus did say something like you get used to it the more you use it. There is only one Abaddon.
ReplyDeleteI liked this episode and I'm surprised that there have been three good episodes in a row now. It was interesting to watch Crowley at the end. It was almost like he was waiting for Dean to kill Sam or to see if Dean would kill Sam. Dean killed another human being. Wonder how many more humans he'll kill with that mark? Dark Dean is really dark because he's killing humans, but supposedly Dark Sam drinking demon blood killed demons. Sad part is, Dean has wanted to kill how many people long before he got that mark. Gordon, Bela and Max come to mind. He probably would have killed all three of them if Sam had not been around.
ReplyDeleteHmmm . . . that's an interesting idea, but I'm thinking his desire for human blood stems from the trials and the feeling he got from it. But he could have been faking the addiction. Who knows?
ReplyDeleteEhh . . . I need more than a single episode for a character arc. The entire thing was resolved last night so I'm not sure why they wasted time w/it. The first 40 minutes of the show felt like filler.
ReplyDeleteHaha :-)
ReplyDeleteI guess for me this started at the end of season 8, and there was a little in Devil May Cry and Heaven Can't Wait too.
ReplyDeleteI think you would enjoy this episode if you watched it - it was one of the episodes where I thought they actually seemed like brothers and Sam really cared about Dean.
ReplyDeleteI'm hoping that won't just be dropped. This writing team always has ideas that are never used again.
ReplyDeleteIt was.
ReplyDeleteEven so, it's confusing to the viewer that in a string of episodes, we have the brothers at odds with each other with Sam saying hurtful things that obviously affect Dean, and then magically in certain scenes, it's as if those moments never happened.
ReplyDeletex
A story has to be told logically, with a beginning, an evolution and an ending. Here the brother relationship jumps about, one writer putting it out one way and another giving their own take.
It's confusing and unpleasant to watch.
x
Why can't the writers give us a few scenes where the brothers really talk to one another and hash out their problems once and for all; problems that have already been repeatedly adressed in previous seasons anyway; but as Carver is determined to keep the brothers at loggerheads, he could at least give them some face-to -face time to let them AND us understand exactly what they are thinking.
These are the main characters of the show, their problems deserve more care and attention.
x
One or two random scenes where the brothers actually remember they are brothers and treat each other accordingly isn't enough. It just doesn't come over as real.
X
I always remember the little opening scene in 'Sam Interrupted' where the brothers tell the truth about themselves; what they do, and their relationship, and they do so knowing they won't be taken seriously but considered crazy. I loved that scene.
Agreed. No show has really touched my heartstrings as has the saga of these two broken,courageous and unfortunate brothers and as long as both are on the show together, I'll hang on to them.
ReplyDeleteViolation possession has not be a issue before. I realize alot of the fandom want it all brushed under the carpet and that Sam has been unreasonable over the whole thing. However Dean created the situation not Sam's words and unless that is acknowledged then I do not want Sam just giving up and Dean gets away with it again.
ReplyDeleteHi. I presume you're referring to this phrase. 'Sam saying hurtful things that obviously affect Dean'.
ReplyDeleteI mentioned that because I was talking about the current episodes, but IMO what Dean said to Sam in season eight about Benny being a better brother than Sam has ever been is far worse; it's the most hurtful thing Dean could have said to Sam. T he brothers hurt each other equally on a regular basis, unfortunately..
x
Having said that I believe Dean acted perfectly in character with what he did. He has always tried to save his brother at all costs, and if Ezekiel hadn't answered, then Dean would have had no other option than to watch Sam die; but Ezekiel did answer, so Dean took the opportunity that was offered to him to keep Sam alive.
Where Dean made the mistake, in my opinion was that he didn't tell Sam afterwards, and I believe that's what is upsetting Sam most, the fact that Dean kept what he'd done a secret.
x
I completely agree though that the show is about two brothers, both fascinating characters, both should be treated equally and given ample opportunity to share their thoughts and feeling with us the viewers.
I tend to see it as Sam trying to slowly warm up to Dean, yet not wanting to, because it will hurt and he doesn't want to be hurt again.
ReplyDeleteCan we be sure Magnus is dead? Or was just another shapeshifter killed?
ReplyDeleteAnd since nobody really dies on the show..........who knows we might get to see Magnus and his invisible Fortress again, next season.
Very true.
ReplyDeleteI agree, I watch this show out of loyalty and past love.
ReplyDeleteI thought this episode was okay. The pacing was really bad, in my opinion. For me, the episode didn't pick up until S&D were sitting down and talking to that guy. Nothing else that occurred in the episode had any purpose. Even Crowley's blood addiction seems to have ended, which begs the question: What was the point of that arc?
ReplyDeleteI did enjoy the scenes w/Dean holding the Blade, and I'm interested to see what it does to him. He was clearly affected by it and seemed to go into a trance of sorts at the end. This should be interesting.
I did find it strange that the tension/angst btw the brother was virtually forgotten. That lack of consistency is not good, IMO.
I think Jensen did a good job of showing how the blade just took Dean out of his mind and body completely. He was totally overcome.
ReplyDeleteBy recent season standards I actually thought this episode had a smart Sam. Yes he was captured at the end, but he got back inside on his own and he killed two of the thugs. Dean had to save him, but he was also a big distraction so Dean would be able to free himself.
I think the point of the blood addiction arc was to show Crowley struggling with who he is, as Dean and Cas have also been doing. I'm also not too sure it's completely over.
ReplyDeleteI agree about the pacing.
Nope. Not at all :-)
ReplyDelete