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Supernatural 9.11 "First Born" Review: To Each His Own Atonement

Jan 22, 2014

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     This week’s episode of Supernatural, “First Born,” was written by Robbie Thompson and directed by John Badham. Badham is perhaps best known as the director of Saturday Night Fever. The episode guest stars Timothy Omundson as Cain. Omundson delivers a wonderful performance, and while he’s been a friend to the Supernatural family for some time, this episode ensures that he is now very firmly a part of the family proper.

    The episode is a bit of a change up and sees Dean (Jensen Ackles) paired with Crowley (Mark Sheppard) while Sam (Jared Padalecki) pairs with Castiel (Misha Collins). Dean, Sam, and Castiel are all suffering from low self-esteem and are focusing on their short-comings. Crowley, of course, is perfectly happy to capitalize on Dean’s weaknesses. Once again, when he’s at a low point, Dean forgets his better judgment never to trust or work with a demon. Crowley tells Dean, “nobody hates you like you hate you.” Cas tries to get Sam to see that he’d agreed with Dean to live instead of closing the gates of Hell and that his life is precious. By the end of the episode, it seems they are each hunting for someone else: Castiel for Metatron, Dean for Abaddon, and Sam for Gadreel.

    There are lots of mirror images in this episode besides the new pairings. Sam is consumed with not letting anyone else be hurt because of him and is still feeling responsible for Kevin’s death. Dean is also still convinced that anyone close to him is doomed to die or be hurt, and Tara’s (Rachel Hayward) death simply reinforces that belief. John’s one weekend stand with Tara is mirrored by Dean’s attempts to seduce the waitress. There are two spells in the episode – one works to find the first blade, but the other fails to find Gadreel. Both Crowley and Cas suggest at the end of the episode that they will need more help to catch their quarry, and both Sam and Dean decline to include the other.

    Cain’s story could also easily be Dean’s. Cain kills his brother to save him from Lucifer and assure his soul went to Heaven while damning his own to Hell. Dean went to Hell in exchange for Sam’s life and also had to save Sam’s soul from Lucifer. Colette (Anna Galvin) could easily be Lisa. Colette knew who Cain was and what he’d done and she loved him unconditionally. All she wanted was for him to stop the killing. Lisa knew who Dean was and what he’d done, and all she wanted was for him to stop – although she tried to make it work with him hunting. If Colette looked familiar, it’s because Galvin also played Mrs Fremont (child-Lilith’s mother) in “No Rest For the Wicked.” Interesting that the actor would have this dual connection to Dean/Hell/murder.

    A quick word about Tara who was brilliantly brought to life by Hayward. It’s always great to see another woman hunter – even if having a Winchester enter her life pretty much seals her fate. Tara was smart, brave, and clearly independent. Hayward certainly looks like she could hold her own in a fight. However, she also admits to the classic hunter failing – obsession. She ends up with a bum knee all alone and her life ruined because of chasing the blade unsuccessfully all over the world.

    It was great seeing John Winchester play a part in this episode. We see that Dean still carries John's journal with him and is still stung when Tara points out that John would have been extremely disappointed in Dean for working with a demon. I loved that they’ve added codes to where John stored more information on the entries. It never made sense for the sum total of John’s 22 years of hunting to fit into that journal. After all, Dean and Sam have been hunting for nine years on the show and their hunts would fill more than that journal. I loved how what the “T” stands for is revealed to be Tara. I do have to wonder why they haven’t simply gathered all of John’s materials into the bunker – even if they have been busy.

    Cas reflects on what being human did to him. He was able to experience life in a completely different way, but now that he’s an angel again his perspective has changed again. When it comes to PB&J, he can’t see the forest for the trees – he can only taste molecules (trees) not the entire sensation of the sandwich. Yet, he at least remembers that his sensations and feelings were different so he has a new appreciation for the sanctity of life and how Sam feels. Old Cas would have drained the life out of Sam, but new Cas sees Sam as an individual and sees worth in that - which is why seeing his PB&J stops Cas from continuing. His hope is that angels can change, so maybe even pig-headed Winchesters can too.

    He is still quintessentially Cas though. He is hilariously offended when Sam tells him he’s a terrible liar, quickly pointing out that he managed to deceive Dean and Sam very effectively when he was working with Crowley. Collins is fantastic at bring yet another level of characterization to Cas. He also still has his completely ingenuous moments, such as his hopeful joy that Sam has a guinea pig stashed somewhere in the bunker and his failing to understand Sam’s teasing about asking a question. It’s a lovely moment when Sam hugs Cas and has to coach him through hugging back.

    Cas asks Sam about his choice to stop the trials and live. Sam agrees that he did choose to live, but then simply continues that Dean made a choice for him after that. Sam then goes on to say that he could have put a stop to everything and closed the gates of Hell. Yet, his death after stopping the trials would not have closed the gates of Hell. Dean didn’t cause the gates of Hell to remain open OR the angels to fall by letting Gadreel possess Sam. It did, however, lead to Kevin’s death. Sam may feel that he needs to avenge Kevin’s death, but he can hardly be responsible for what Gadreel did while in possession of Sam’s body. I found this scene disappointing, and I hope this will be addressed further. Being human means settling your debts, according to Sam and he wants to start balancing the books. Padalecki brings a new layer to his portrayal of Sam in the episode as we see his desperation to fix what he can.

    Crowley, played exquisitely by the King of Genre Sheppard, has, as always, many of the episode’s best lines. I loved him crossing himself when Cain displays his mark and his teacup rattling as he shares tea with Cain. It is always a joy to watch Crowley work both sides against the middle. Dean recognizes that Crowley has played him. I’m still curious about Crowley’s addiction to blood. Has he really changed in some fundamental way? Does he maybe want to return to being King of Hell to shut the gates himself? Or does he want to make it a kinder and gentler version of Hell than what it would be under Abaddon? Was he simply trying to water his demon blood down enough to escape the various demon traps he was ensnared in?

    It was nice to see Dean figuring out some of the puzzle on his own. He pieces together Cain’s motivation when he finds Colette’s photo and makes the connection to Cain’s ring. He left his life of destruction for the love of a woman. Omundson is wonderful in the scene in Colette dies and then he asks her forgiveness before rejoining the fight. It’s a lovely touch when he kisses the ground over her grave.

    Ackles and Omundson really pushed each other to their best work. I loved Omundson simply watching as he tests Dean’s reputation as brave but impulsive. The fight scene was amazing and Ackles shot the entire scene himself with no stunt doubles. I was a little disappointed in all the super close-ups and cuts that interrupted really seeing what was going on at times – but that is, as always, my person complaint about such scenes.

    It was inevitable that we would draw parallels between these two first born sons. Dean has identified himself as a killer for a very long time, and Cain is the father of murder. However, in a great Supernatural twist, we see that Cain didn’t murder his brother without a good reason. In every way that matters, Cain saved his brother’s soul.

    One interesting possible influence on the episode is Neil Gaiman’s Sandman series which features a character, Destruction, who appears in Brief Lives and Endless Nights. Crowley, of course, has been linked to the Good Omens novel that Gaiman co-wrote with Terry Pratchett. The character is described as having a large beard and having abandoned his responsibilities, retiring to the country. Destruction dedicates himself to trying to create rather than destroy – much like Cain’s concern for the bees as life on earth will end if all the bees die. Destruction even cooks a last meal for his guests before he disappears again. In Brief Lives, Destruction tries to counsel another character on the need to change and self knowledge.

    There's another comics reference as Dean and Crowley enter the pawn shop and Tara is reading Joe Hill's comic series Locke & Key (see picture above). The first series was called Welcome to Lovecraft - a name we've heard before on Supernatural.

    Dean is determined to kill Abaddon. He is willing to pay “the great cost” that carrying Cain’s mark will force upon him if it means he can “kill the bitch.” Like Cain, killing simply leads to more killing, and perhaps this is the lesson that Dean needs to learn. Sam needs to learn to forgive – both himself and his brother. It was an interesting twist to see Dean take on Cain’s mark, I hope we won’t have to wait too long to find out what the burden might be. I have to wonder if it is going to be the inability to die himself. The demon knife does not kill Cain and the legend is that Cain cannot be killed. I loved the shout out to Saturday Night Fever as Dean tells Cain "Let's dance" as he clasps his arm. Kudos to the VFX team for the terrific effect of the transfer of the mark.

    Cain’s demand that Dean come to him and kill him when he calls seems like it’s too easy a request. Will Dean have become sick of killing by then? Will the call mean he can’t protect someone else? Only time will tell, but it does seem to promise that we will be seeing Omundson again. The mark is obviously physically paining Dean, so it will be interesting to see if that continues and its other effects. Anybody else think that Sam is going to be pretty upset with his brother when he sees it? I’m betting Cas will also have a few choice words for Dean.

    What did you think of the episode? While I love hearing everyone’s comments and discussing your thoughts with you, please let’s refrain from entering into the tired Sam versus Dean debates. I’m really not interested in engaging in the writers obviously hate this character or that character or counting up each character’s screen time. But do let me know what you think about Sam’s determination to settle the books, Crowley’s mechanizations, Ombundson’s wonderful portrayal of Cain, or Dean’s acquiring the mark in the comments below.

176 comments:

  1. I think it will be very interesting, to see how everything turns out .Really do love the new twist in the plot did not see it coming .:-) :-)

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  2. Your review was really enlightening and I've watched the episode three times ha. Well done and thankyou. All the Cain/Abel and Dean/Sam theories are really interesting. I love the brothers and the way they react when the others name comes up or mentioned is fascinating acting. Same with John Winchester. Anyway, thanks the season has been pretty good so far, its hard to reach the heights of the first few seasons but S9 is giving me those Winchester feels again.

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  3. I fully expected that Dean and Cain would identify with each other, but I didn't see this coming either! Can't wait to see where they run with it!

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  4. Thanks - and I agree! I doubt we will ever have Kripke-level shows because we don't have Kripke. Whoever takes over as showrunner is going to leave their own stamp on the show. I think it's taken Carver a little while to get there, but overall, I'm really liking this season too!

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  5. Thanks! I agree to some extent about the Sam/Cas scenes - that one conversation just didn't track at all for me. It felt like he just deflected talking about the real issue - what Dean did. It's funny, but I never feel like I'm missing Sam POV. For me, Jared emoted all over the screen and it was easy to tell what Sam was thinking/feeling.
    I definitely Sam meant that he and Cas "had it" and didn't need to call Dean for help.
    I don't think Cain will make it intentionally hard, but I think that the show really relies on your actions have consequences - so Dean saves Sam but it ends up costing Kevin his life. So, Dean gets the mark to kill Abaddon, but the price of killing Cain will cost something unexpected - something not even Cain will have anticipated.
    I think they did an amazing job at making Cain a sympathetic character - not easy to do with the father of murder after all!
    Thanks for a great comment!

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  6. I don't trust Sam. He took the failed spell too well for my taste. Dean, as usual leaps before he looks. Personally, whether to save m brother/world or not, I'd be a bit curious as to what the "burden" was. I'd probably still go through with it, I'm as pigheaded, but I'd still like to know what's coming for me. Michael told Dean a long time ago that he's part of the Cain/Abel blood line, so the whole transfer seems a long time coming…

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  7. Do you think Sam is still being influenced by Gadreel? I took his resignation as a continuation of his quiet determination - he's not loudly vengeful the way Dean is. Yes, it troubled me too that Dean didn't even want any explanation of what the burden might be. Of course, as Crowley said, no one hates Dean as much as Dean hates himself - Dean already figures he's damned anyway, so how much worse can it get? Again - silly on his part. He's a Winchester - he should know it can _always_ get worse for him!
    I really liked that they came back to the Cain/Abel bloodline. I think the writers are trying a lot harder to maintain the continuity (even if they aren't always as successful as they think they are!)

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  8. I know what you mean about Sam POV, I usually feel the same and think I know Sam, but he comes out and tells Dean he was looking up to him since he was 4, or he can accept anyone's distrust but Dean's, things like these I'd never think Sam say. Maybe I expect for these feelings to be verbally addressed.


    You might have a point there, as the one of the themes of S9 is actions and consequences. Now I'm getting really worried!!

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  9. I loved this episode :)
    Cain is very interesting, I hope we'll see him again soon...and it was beautiful to have Dean with Crowley (I love Mark Sheppard!) and finally Cass with Sammy. I disagree only with a point in this review: I don't think Lisa was Dean's "Colette", he is too much in love with his hunter life to drop it for a woman.

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  10. I liked the episode. But I think the obvious parallel with Colette is Cas. He saw what Dean was and what Dean did in Hell and he didn't judge. He thought Dean was worthy of being forgiven and saved.

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  11. Lisa? Really?! She hasn't been relevant in three years, if anything, after the blind faith and acceptance Dean receives in 9x10 it's an obvious parallel to Cas.

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  12. I really enjoyed this episode. There were parts where I felt that Mark Sheppard and Timothy Omundson stole the show, but I guess that's to be expected when you have two actors of their caliber are being directed by John Badham. I agree that Jensen did a fantastic job playing off against Omundson, their scenes together were the highlight of the episode for me. I liked the "buddy cop" banter with Crowley but thought that maybe they shouldn't have thrown quite so many jokes into the dialogue between them because I was really looking forward to seeing Jensen and Mark's scenes together in this one. Snarky Crowley and Angry Dean has been done before, I guess I was just hoping for a bit more than that. I was pleasantly surprised with the Sam and Castiel scenes, Jared and Misha do seem to have some palpable chemistry with one another - the dynamic between them was a lot closer to brotherhood than what we've seen previously and it was nice to see that bit of evolution between the two characters.

    As for Dean taking on the mark of Cain - I completely did not see that coming and I'm really looking forward to seeing how this plays out. I feel as if this episode had a lot of parallels to season 4 thrown into it. Sam is finally getting the validation from an angel that he's prayed for his entire life and Dean is being corrupted by a demon. I am a bit worried about what this means for both brothers though. With Sam's anti-possession tattoo gone and Dean bearing the Mark of Cain, is this foreshadowing that Abaddon will possess Sam and Dean will have to make the choice between killing Abaddon and his own brother in the process? It just seems like it's too obvious of a plot line to me, and a huge plot hole for Sam not to get inked up as soon as possible but I could see Jeremy Carver going that route for some reason. But you'd think that after everything that's happened to Sam as far as being possessed is concerned he'd be a hell of a lot smarter than to be running around without the tattoo. The dumbing down of that character particularly this season is one of my pet peeves and I really hope that Carver doesn't try to go that very obvious route.

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  13. Imagine if in the end Dean will have to kill Cass... O_O

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  14. lol! Yeah, as soon as Dean jumped to taking the mark, I was actually yelling at him: "At LEAST find out what the burden IS first, dimwit!" you'd think he'd have learned by now, but apparently not.

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  15. I have to say that comparing Colette to Lisa is frankly one of the most absurd and heteronormative things I've heard in a long time. Just last episode we saw Cas expressing his unconditional forgiveness and devotion to Dean, as Colette did to Cain. Cain prays at her graveside and says he knows she is watching over him. Who does Dean pray to? Who watches over him? Cas. That you went back *three years* to find a female character to fit into your preexisting idea of what a romantic connection should be for Dean instead of seeing the obvious parallels right in front of you is really disappointing.

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  16. What a great review! I like this episode a lot more than I thought I would (when I heard Cain was appearing, my eyes actually rolled), and I very much like how you tease out the parallels and subtexts.
    Shame on you for not going with Destiel, though!! tsk tsk. *rolls eyes*

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  17. I kept hearing Dean in my head telling Sam, "You can't trust Ruby, she's a demon, you never trust a demon." and yet there he was in a full-blown bromance with Crowley for the same reason. Using the same excuse Sam always used. "I know I can't trust her, but I'm doing this for the best of all, but I'll never fully trust her". Uh huh, sure … we all know where that ends LOL

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  18. Can't wait to see Cain again! We'll have to agree to disagree about Lisa - I know this is quite a sore point among fans. I will say that Dean could no more give up hunting than Cain was ultimately ever able to give up killing - just one more thing they have in common. Neither can have that "normal" existence...

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  19. Something about the way Sam was quiet and almost "humoring" Cas (or at least it seemed to me) bothered me. I wouldn't put it past Sam to stick that syringe in his own neck to see if any more grace is there. Do I think he's being influenced? If he still has even a drop of Gadreel's grace, I think he may be. Of course, we'll have the internal war, literally and figuratively if he does with Sam's eventual win, but it'll be a hard fought one and I'm sure plenty of collateral damage. I'm putting Cas at the crux of this one for the win. Just my take on it.

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  20. I don't understand why you're getting ragged on for the Lisa parallel because that's what I thought of as well. Perhaps it's because we both share the name? lol On a more serious note though, I did automatically draw that parallel myself so it's not just you. I see Dean's love of hunting going out the window without the presence of Sam in his life and Lisa (and Ben) ultimately became his reason to stay out of the life.

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  21. That's an interesting take on the scene that I hadn't really thought about until now. Sam did seem as if he was humoring Cas and I don't believe for one second that he's completely over his death wish, which is sad. I noticed in the "Then" recap that there was a bit of dialogue that never made it into last week's episode that sheds more light into Sam's psyche. He said something along the lines of "I said I didn't want to live if it meant others could get hurt" in reference to what happened to Kevin and that seems to be what's driving him right now. He is beating himself up over that a lot and even though it's completely unnecessary, I can see him becoming more and more self destructive with the guilt of Kevin's death weighing so heavily on him.

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  22. Cain/Colette was a DIRECT parallell to Dean/Cas. DIRECT one. Lisa didn’t know what Dean did in hell. For Lisa Dean was a bitter hero, not someone who torments souls in hell, she never got to that part.

    Cas knew all of it. So Cain said “She knew who I was, what I was. She loved me unconditionally.” and then, kneeling before her grave he said “I know you watch over me”.

    Watch over!

    "Angels watch over you" - Mary said in season 5

    "I’ll watch over you" - Cas said in season 8

    that was a direct parallel to Cas

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  23. Well, I mean, OBVIOUSLY Collete is Lisa. I mean, who else is Dean close
    to who completely forgives him for everything he did (in Hell and on
    Earth) and thinks he's worth saving? Who supports and defends him? Whom
    Dean prays to, who watches over him, whom Dean has fought and killed his
    way through monster for? Who accepts him unconditionally? Who has done
    all these things as recently as THIS VERY EPISODE? No one, not one
    single person, nobody even remotely like that except for a lukewarm love
    interest from three seasons ago who hasn't been mentioned in years and
    doesn't even remember Dean.

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  24. And I'm leery about Cas. He did point out that he has lied and betrayed the brothers before, and that may be foreshadowing the idea that he may have been lying about the spell not working. He's working with another angel's grace and we don't know how that affects him add that to the reminder tat he is not always a terrible liar and i"m not sure about Cas.

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  25. Colette was meant to be Castiel in comparison. I don't know how anyone could read it any other way, what with the very episode BEFORE, Dean apologizing to Cas, and Cas forgiving him. Once again. Loving him unconditionally no matter how bad he messes up. I mean, come on, he was even praying to her and asking her to watch over him!! Wtf people?? Open your heternormative eyes!

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  26. I will say that I would LOVE to get Abel's POV about how in danger he was of caving to Lucifer. IRL murderers always say they had a good reason and they often believe it. We just had a case yesterday where a woman killed two children because she honestly believed they were possessed and her "exorcism" was so brutal they died. We are taking Cain's word that he was RIGHT about Abel caving to Lucifer.

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  27. My son just brought up a point I didn't remember. When Michael killed Anna and spoke to Dean he said they were the same bloodline as Caine & Abel and Dean, as well as Caine, were his (Michael's) true vessels. Now if Michael was using Caine, did Caine truly kill the Knights of Hell or did Michael? Not to mention that I believe Michael did say he killed them. I guess they could've switched up the plot line a bit, or perhaps continuity wasn't spot on, but it's worth a thought.
    As far as Sam and his "doesn't want anyone else hurt" state of mind, I'm thinking that is also his driving force and like Dean, he's going to go after Gadreel headfirst if he thinks it will stop the deaths. That's why I feel Cas is really going to be the saving grace (excuse the pun lol) here. His new found humanity and the bond he is now forging with Sam which had only been with Dean in the past is going to play a key. I feel Cas is going to take out Gadreel which will lead to Megatron and in doing so put Sam's mind to rest. I was also thinking of Megatron saying he took care of the prophets. Now if there are no more prophets which are the voice of God does that mean there is no God? I think not. Megatron may have closed Heaven but I sincerely doubt he stopped the voice of God. I'm thinking a prophet will be returning semi-soon. By the way, the internet is buzzing saying that the burden of Caine is the fact that whoever wears the brand must kill the brother. Again, more food for thought.

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  28. This is Dean after all... our man of action...

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  29. I don't think Dean was in a bromance with Crowley. He's been using Crowley for access to weapons since Abandon All Hope... However, following his usual path again lead to someone else dying - this time Tara.

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  30. I suspect that if he did lie about the spell, he did it to protect Sam who is in no shape to be hunting an angel without backup...

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  31. Agreed! But I actually hesitated to put this in the review because of how much hate there is for Lisa in the fandom at large... Of course, at the end of the day, I gotta say what I think!

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  32. Cas was sent to get Dean out of Hell on orders from Heaven. At first, Cas had very little use for Dean. I think Cas' new perspective comes from having tasted how hard it is to be human - which has actually resulted in him fully forgiving and understanding Sam...

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  33. Agreed about Sheppard and Omundson! I believe the scuttlebutt is that Sam has his tattoo back in the next episode - apparently the theory is that Cas restored it when he healed him? We shall see. It would be absolutely stupid for them not to re-ink him, especially after the first thing they did with Kevin and Mrs Tran was ink them just last year. But I do like the interesting possibility of Abaddon possessing Sam...

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  34. In the actual show that plays on television, there is no explicit romantic relationship between Dean and Castiel. I'm reviewing the show, not fan fiction. And for the record, I've written my own share of Destiel. The fact that some people can't separate and enjoy both the show as it's written and the expanded universe of fan works is frankly sad. Also, by your analogy, any relationship between Dean and Cas would be doomed just as Cain and Colette's was.

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  35. Thanks! And way to court those down votes!

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  36. I agree that it would be very interesting to get Abel's POV somehow - is it possible that he's on earth, having been expelled from heaven? However, I'm assuming that Cain got his orders from God who would have been in a good position to know what was in Abel's heart... maybe?

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  37. FYI - Check out the severe Destiel hate that I'm getting below!

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  38. Omundson is almost *too* good in this episode. In the scene where the
    big fight is going down in the kitchen, it's hard to take your eyes away
    from him and all he's doing is shucking corn and sipping on a beer. I
    heard that they rehearsed that fight scene for 9 hours and Jensen Ackles
    did his own stuntwork for it, so you were obviously supposed to be
    paying attention to the fight. Yet my concentration was completely on
    Cain. That's a hell of a screen presence!


    About Sam possibly being possessed by Abaddon, I really hope that's not going to happen. I think it's time for Sam to just be Sam for a while. That poor guy has had more foreign entities in him than the United Nations! I really hope you're right and Castiel did restore the tattoo, or he was out getting re-inked before returning to find Cas eating that PB&J sandwich. It would be pretty dumb of him not to get re-inked ASAP.

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  39. http://pondlifeforme.tumblr.com/post/74159780000/cain-dean-parallels I think this just sums it up nicely and I don't even watch :)

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  40. ...I'm pretty sure Colette was meant to represent Cas, and it was meant to be foreshadowing. Colette was killed because Cain was trying to kill Abaddon. Now, Dean has to kill Abaddon, and if we know that the demons have the info that Cas was recently human (secretary demon in 9x10), and that Cas's grace is not his own (which means he'll obviously be human again), AND that Cas does NOT have an anti-possession tattoo (and Carver said that that would be significant), it stands to reason that Abaddon will possess Cas at some point later in the season, and either she will kill Cas or Dean will have to. Plus, you know, all the parallels with Colette forgiving Cain over and over and seeing him as something better than what he thought he was.

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  41. Yeah I saw it. I think you're right on the mark with your replies though. Some people just can't see the difference between fanon and canon. There's nothing wrong with shipping, reading/writing fanfic and enjoying those aspects of fandom, but maybe some people would do better to pay attention to the actual plot that's taking place in front of them on the show instead of looking too deeply into the subtext. Sorry you're taking such a beating on that front!

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  42. See this gifset for abundant clarity: http://fandomsdevouredmysoul.tumblr.com/post/74176086346/pondlifeforme-cain-dean-parallels-this

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  43. Thanks. I suppose if you are going to put your opinion out there, you have to take the lumps. I appreciate that they are passionate about what they would like to see.

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  44. I agree so hard with this! But the thing that bothers me the most is that Dean gave Cas such shit for working with Crowley when Cas was trying to save all of heaven, his HOME, and all his hundreds of thousands of brothers and sisters from having to suffer needlessly through a civil war....but put Sammy life on the line and suddenly its ok to work with Crowley. Like...seriously, Dean?! REALLY?!

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  45. There can't be one single article without the Destiel shippers from twitter and tumblr descending on the comment section to try and ~prove their supposed parallels and disagree with anyone that doesn't see it. Like how Charlie/Glinda was supposed to prove this epic love. Seriously, people, you're embarrassing yourselves.

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  46. "Sam needs to learn to forgive – both himself and his brother."
    I'm sorry, then what, exactly, has Sam been doing for the past 9 seasons? Holding grudges against poor, poor Dean and pointing out his mistakes time and time again, rubbing his face into each and every one of them? Does it not sound slightly wrong and misplaced to you? Because Dean is the one constantly giving Sam crap for the mistakes he long atoned for. Dean is the one who needs to learn to freaking forgive already because, goddamit, this abuse needs to stop.
    Sam does need to learn to forgive _himself_, however. 'Cause after everything, after all the ordeals he's been through, all the suffering and atoning and sacrificing, he just _deserves_ peace and love and forgiveness.

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  47. I confess--I am one of those Lisa haters. But I'd never rag on you for drawing a parallel. I generally read it and then mumble under my breath about it. LOL

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  48. Though I respect your opinion, I can't see Lisa mirroring Colette. I think it's Cas. I mean, Cain ended up hurting his brother when he wanted to save him, Colette forgave Cain his past errors and grounded him, Cain fell in love with someone who knew him and who forgave him, Cain prayed to Colette because he had faith. I'll go into it more, if you'd like.

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  49. Nimrod: not just an Old Testament king. (Ironically, the originator of babble.)

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  50. True. Oh the irony!

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  51. I wonder how power hungry Dean has gotten. We saw him readily use the powers available to him already this season (via Gadreel) and he almost took Cain's arm off to get at the mark (and killing power associated with it).

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  52. Now, THIS is how to present an alternative viewpoint, rather than petty insults or sarcasm. Just make your alternate case politely.

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  53. Thank you, sir! To me, it's much more logical than reaching back to season six for a Colette parallel, as I'm sure these episodes are tying into current characters and their concurrent storylines, and has very little to do with shipping. Even if Dean/Cas are not romantically involved, it is common knowledge that Cas loves Dean unconditionally (platonically so or not), and 9x10 certainly showed us that he is willing to forgive him and provide reasoning and comfort to Dean's madness, over and over again. I am certain that Crowley's discovery of a human Castiel was not an insignificant one, and as such, I agree with the comments about the parallel, but I never condone hostility in differing opinions. :)

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  54. See, again, there you go. Respectful disagreement. It is actually possible to have different viewpoints without descending to insult and pettiness. Thanks for setting a good example.

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  55. Oh, I'm sorry, I'm a Destiel shipper too, but I think that the parallel between Cain and Dean you made is a little weak not because I believe that Dean's true love is Cass, but because the only canon thing in the show is that Dean had no “Colette”. ;)

    Cain really did changed his life for Colette, and he behaved well for years even after her death...Dean went to Lisa's house only to respect Sammy's last wish, she never knew of his time in Hell, and in the end they weren't each other number one priority. I think that Dean would leave her not only for Sammy, but also for another regular hunt, or for revenge, or for Cass, if the angel had asked his help and not Crowley's. (And this is why Cass did not reveal himself in Lisa’s backyard, sadly).

    I think Cass is now the person who " knew that Dean was and what he had done and who loved him unconditionally ," but I do not think Dean would change his life for him, or for anyone else. And, destiel or not, this is what I like about Dean ;)

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  56. I think she was referring solely to the possession storyline, not anything that has happened prior to that. And I agree with her assessment, Sam does need to forgive both Dean and himself or this is going to end up eating him alive. He's not handling this well, at all. His behavior during the extraction was borderline suicidal. That's not a healthy mindset to be in and it breaks my heart to think that he's putting himself through all of that. If he can find it in his heart to forgive Dean, it only stands to reason that he'll go a long ways towards being able to forgive himself, even if he really shouldn't be blaming himself for Kevin's death to begin with. We all know that Sam doesn't hold grudges, it's not in his character to be that way. Dean will hold onto a grudge forever but I think that has more to do with Dean's own abandonment issues and self-loathing nature.

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  57. The actual show, as written, set up direct parallels with Cas/Colette. Clear, direct parallels set in the current story arc and character arcs. Your condescension towards x-cetera here is really distasteful. At least look at the excellent meta folks like x-cetera write and the thoughtful, intelligent, insightful things they have to say about story arcs, A/B/C plot structures and mirroring going on with Dean/Cas. It might not end up romantic and it might not lead us to canon Destiel, but there is STUFF happening there with the writing and direction of the characters.



    It really is more of a reach to go to Lisa than to go to Cas, explicit canon romance or not. Lisa is not, IMO, that level of life changing importance to Dean. As was said, she's been gone for years and not even mentioned in the show in forever. That is not my love of Destiel talking, either. Lisa isn't central to Dean's life *right now* and I see no reason to believe the writers are taking us that direction.



    There are plenty of reasons to see them taking Dean towards a closer relationship with Cas, romantically or even just platonically. And not necessarily to a doomed one, either. Dean already subverted the mirror with Cain by saving Sam rather than killing him. If he continues on that sort of path, he'll also save Cas where Cain killed Colette. But we'll just have to wait and see what happens.

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  58. It doesn't have to be explicit for it to be part of the show. Subtext is a thing! Parallels are not announced explicitly on the screen -- you make your own interpretation. Just like I make my own interpretation here. Misha Collins himself has acknowledged that some of the writers deliberately layer in the subtext. If you're going to analyze the show, you have to read between the lines and find the things that are *implicit*. This is not "fan fiction". It's not "sad" that I want same sex relationships to be treated with the same respect and consideration of plausibility as m/f ones. I will not stand for being told to go off and have my fantasies somewhere else when this show has clearly built up heavy romantic associations between Dean & Castiel through romantic tropes, subtext, and narrative weight.

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  59. Thanks for sticking up for me & appreciating my meta! :)

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  60. Well, after making a special effort to see this episode last night (given that it was preempted here), I can say that it was totally worth getting up at midnight to watch. To my surprise, I actually enjoyed the brothers working with other partners for this episode. (As long as it doesn't go on too long! Of course.)

    Crowley was his old snarky, charming self and I wasn't nearly as suspicious of him as I should've been. Not that I was completely surprised but I was lulled a little bit by the charm.

    Dean's fight scene in the house was incredible. I had no idea that Jensen did all that himself. Knowing that, I now too wish we wouldn't have had so many close up shots. Bravo, Jensen.

    If I didn't see a parallel with Lisa (I didn't but I'm not always great at picking up on these things AND I don't like Lisa so...)--but if I didn't pick up on a parallel with Lisa, I for darn sure didn't pick up on a Destiel one.

    I really, really liked the scenes between Sam and Castiel and found myself quite touched by them. It was nice to see them connecting.

    Okay, I must confess--I admit it--I was hoping that the acquisition of the mark of Cain would have some deleterious physical side effects for Dean. Imagine my disappointment.

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  61. Are you aware that this is not the first time that Supernatural AND Robbie Thompson have
    used a romantic couple as a parallel for Dean and Castiel? In Larp And The
    Real Girl Gilda, who was eventually kissing Charlie, was being
    controlled to hurt people and needed a hero to break her free of the
    spell which was a direct parallel to Robbie’s later episode Goodbye Stranger, where Dean broke Castiel out of his control under Naomi. That is not fanfiction, that is canon. Also, the parallel doesn't by some mythical rule have to play out exactly as it did with Colette and Cain, Castiel could be possessed, Dean could try to kill him, he could succeed or be thwarted.

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  62. "Colette could EASILY be Lisa?" WAIT, WHAT? I'm really sorry but I think there has been a huge mistake there. I mean no disrespect but it's incredibly obvious that Colette is a parallel to CASTIEL (whether people want to see it romantically or not). Cain even said in the episode that Colette still watched over him and that is something that Cas does in Dean's life. That's why Robbie Thompson, the writer of the episode, said he rewatched episodes 5x13 (where Mary says the famous phrase "Angels are watching over you") and 6x20 (where we can actually SEE Castiel watching over Dean). Besides, in season 8 we got Cas himself telling Dean "I'll watch over you" in 8x08. I really wonder how the author of this article thought about Lisa (who hasn't been in the show for 3 seasons and is not relevant to the story in terms of what is happening right now), and didn't think about Castiel (who is a major character in everything that's going on in season 9). Is it because Cas is in a male vessel? It really makes me wonder!

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  63. The bottom line is really simple. They all do the wrong thing for the right reason. Dean taking Crowley and allowing Gadreel in Sam. Castiel and the souls. Sam thinking the demon blood actually helped. They each had the best intentions. Ironic how they lived up to the saying that the road to hell is paved with good intentions and in their case that's often literal. In a way it's refreshing because they're human frailties and everyone makes mistakes; seems even angels. It doesn't always come out all bright and happy. Makes the show and the storyline more enjoyable, at least to me.

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  64. Again, this is how to express an alternate or contrary viewpoint: polite disagreement and a statement of that alternate view, rather than insult or sarcasm. Thanks for setting a good example.

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  65. I'm gonna be honest here. As someone who has just watched 1 episode this season, I think it's perfectly fine if people are reaching and want to try to find some parallels between Dean and Lisa (or any other femme character for that matter). It's not like this show will ever treat a potential love interest with the same respect that it does with the main leads. Every side character on this show is more like an object, an accessory rather than someone with a compelling storyline alongside the Winchesters. Except for Cas, of course. So it's not surprising that people connect the characters with each other that they can genuinely invested in an root for (for an extended period of time). That's Destiel in a nutshell and therefore contains far more storytelling substance than Dean/f or even Dean/other m. Because Cas is a much more developed character. It's not surprising that people draw more parallels between characters who are currently relevant to the story and also reflecting on the emotions that have been mirrored just one episode prior.
    That being said, Robbie Thompson once confirmed on twitter that any parallels were not to be seen as that (especially the one with Charlie/Gilda--Dean/Cas). He said any stuff that people draw from these parallels is accidental, which means that we aren't "supposed to look that deep" into it. The parallels are to be seen as a singular entity separate from different plot points. And the fact is that the Supernatural writers barely remember their own canon mythology. So as far as relationships goes, you can't expect better.
    Another point is that it annoys the hell out of me when people bring that old fanfiction argument into m/m discussions with an attitude that speaks of deliberate intent to insult people who are invested in two m/m characters getting together. It's a double standard that reflects on our society and the way we watch tv shows, because if people in the comment section have been up in arms for Dean/Cassie being the more fitting parallel instead of Dean/Lisa, the fanfiction and shipping argument would've never been brought up. It needs to stop once and for all. People need to understand that any potential queer reading of the characters is just as valid as any textual evidence of a male identified character's relationship with a woman. It has nothing to do with fanfiction or wishful thinking or delusions. It has everything to do with people looking behind the obvious and reading canon in critical and subversive ways with subtext that is deliberate part of a show's canon.
    And last point. SPN is not a show that will ever do us justice in that department. It's too simplistic for that, which is why you won't get queer Dean or Cas and why any parallels are just accidental rather than meant to be understood that way. The lol gay effect is still more important to TPTB than queer subtext and even more important than queer text in the end. So celebrate the relationships you root for. Hetero still wins in the end. Sad as that is. And it won't help anybody to give people hope that SPN will ever change that. It won't.

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  66. It makes you wonder what? How different people can have different opinions? How events in a work of fiction might have more than one meaning? I think the Cas parallels are legitimate and make for a perfectly viable interpretation, but is it really that inconceivable that viewers might see a guy who lost a loved woman over a century ago and a guy who lost a woman three years ago, and who specifically recognizes the loss of a sexual partner--via the shared rings in the picture and on Cain's hand--as key to understanding Cain's situation, as having a parallel in that--or a guy who's been told he might have to kill his brother in order to save him, and a guy who tells us he killed his brother in order to save him, as having a parallel in that? Does one possiblity negate or preclude the others?

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  67. You're right. A work of fiction can have many valid interpretations. And if people want to see Colette as a parallel to Lisa, what can we do? And this makes me wonder how deep the preconceptions we have can run. Sometimes it's easier to remember a woman (sexual partner?) that Dean lost 3 years ago than to be open to the idea that he might love another person (man in this case) who knows everything about him (even the time he spent in hell, torturing souls) and who still thought he deserved to be saved (since the very first time they met). All I'm saying here is that the possibility of being Lisa doesn't negate the possibility of being Cas either. In fact, Castiel is a logical interpretation if we take into account what Robbie Thompson (the writer) himself said. Somehow, he wanted us to remember episodes in seasons 5 and 6. If he wanted us to remember Lisa, why didn't he say he re-watched 6x21 (when Dean lost Lisa) instead of saying he re-watched 6x20 (when Cas was watching over Dean)? How could we explain the connection between the 3 episodes (5x13, 6x20, 9x11), including the "watching over you" phrase Cain himself used? Sometimes the most obvious answer is right in front of us, but we don't want to see it.

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  68. Robbie Thompson said himself on twitter that any parallels people saw between Charlie/Gilda was accidental and NOT his intention.

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  69. Or one just doesn't see it. Why do you (want to) ascribe motive to someone not seeing it?

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  70. What everyone also seems to conveniently forget is that there was a legitimate, 100% scripted "I love you" from Dean to Cas in the crypt scene in 8x17. It was only removed because Jensen felt that Dean wouldn't admit that to Cas /at that time/, and I agree. If Dean ever explicitly states those words, I'd hope it wouldn't be in a time of great distress so other people wouldn't have an easier time disregarding it or writing it off and cheapening the meaning in some convoluted way. I'll let you in on a little secret: Lots of Destiel shippers have no problem separating fanon from canon, it's the anti-destiel viewers who have a hard time accepting the blatant subtext and parallels when all signs point to Destiel.

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  71. I responded in kind. Her tone and comments were not in the least respectful. I don't appreciate her "absurd" comment or saying I "disappointed" her. Quite uncalled for - as are your comments here. If you don't appreciate my opinion or respect it, please don't read.

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  72. I did not say it was "sad" that you want same sex relationships treated with respect. Please don't read between the lines of what I say or rather, don't read your own meaning into them. You are entitled to your opinion of the show based on your interpretation. I base my interpretation upon the show as I see it - and as many others do as well.

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  73. How can you possibly know if you don't watch?

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  74. I don't want that. I came to this article to point out how I see it. You either agree or disagree. But am I supposed to change the way I think just because someone wrote something different or someone doesn't share my opinion? Nope! Just as you are not supposed to do it either. We live in a world where (I think) we can express our opinions and deserve to be respected. Would you like my comments better if I agree with you in everything? I can't do that. Sorry. To each his own! :)

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  75. You realize that you could also read that sentence as Sam needs to forgive himself the way that he forgave his brother? So in addition to forgiving Dean, he forgives himself?

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  76. LOL! I agree with everything you say - even that last point! Apparently the fight scene took 7 or 8 hours to shoot. Jensen really was quite the trooper! Honestly, the whole Colette thing is getting blown completely out of proportion - everyone seems to be forgetting that the important connection here is BETWEEN THE BROTHERS! So, no worries about not seeing the entire Colette thing. Honestly, I just threw that in as an interesting possible parallel - not the be all and end all of my review - imagine my shock and dismay at all the attacks here because of it!

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  77. I certainly respect your opinion though I couldn't disagree more. And perhaps you might want to revisit the way you begin your comment and end it before you declare that you are showing any respect for my opinion. At the end of the day, the important parallel in this episode has NOTHING to do with Cas or Colette and everything to do with the brothers.

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  78. The deleterious (nice wording btw, I actually had to look that up) side effects could still happen. I have NO idea where they're taking this story, so colour me excited.


    I had no idea Jensen did all that and my respect for him just notched up even higher than it already was. The man respects his craft.

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  79. Only two point to this lengthy condemnation of myself. A. This show has no good strong female characters - other than Jody Mills - because the fans have shown time and again that they don't want them. I've written a book on this if you'd like more information. B. You're right. Fans aren't going to change the way television writers write until they actually become television writers themselves.

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  80. I accept it. You're right when you say that I didn't show as much respect as I should have (though I don't think I offended you). I also write and when I do it, I know the risks (someone might come and say a couple of things I won't like) but it's still a good exercise to put into words what we originally thought. I really liked the rest of your review, though unfortunately, what caught my attention was the one thing I considered was reaching for straws. If I read another of your reviews in the future, I'll express my opinion in a more respectful way if by any chance we disagree in a matter.

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  81. I was responding specifically to "we don't want to to see it," which means something rather different from "we don't see it." It ascribes motive (whether conscious/intentional motive or not) to the person who is not WANTING to see something. If someone disagrees with me, I don't assume it's because they don't WANT TO see as I do (that would seem an unfair if not arrogant assumption on my part). I assume it's because their own process of interpretation has led them somewhere else, and that they have not (or not yet, anyway--one can live in hope) been convinced by my point of view. I agree that we live (or ought to--sometimes I wonder) in a world where we can have different opinions, express them, and be respected regardless of those differences. Several commentators in this thread have managed quite respectfully to disagree with Lisa (the reviewer) about whether Lisa (the character) is a or the best parallel. Several others have settled for insult, sarcasm, and other unproductive strategies. My responses to you emerge from my uncertainty about the implications (intended or otherwise) of some aspects of your generally respectfully-phrased responses. I'm glad that ultimately we agree that respectful disagreement and the equal validity of alternate (and possibly even mutually exclusive) readings are at least possible.

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  82. Robbie Thompson is extremely diplomatic on twitter and frankly I don't blame him, he's often inundated with tweets about shipping. He doesn't take sides publicly on those sorts of issues and he famously doesn't interpret his work for you, or agree/disagree with other's interpretation. If you just look at the text from LARP and Goodbye Stranger you don't have to have an English degree to make the connection. The point that I'm trying to make about the Colette to Castiel and the Gilda/Charlie parallel is that this doesn't mean that Dean and Castiel will definitively be canon, or that this subtext is inherently romantic. The show has used romantic couples as parallels to Sam and Dean before as well. It's just you can't limit the possibility of an interpretation because it has to fix the M/F mold.

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  83. My generally respectfully-phrased responses and the way you may have interpreted some of them might have a lot to do with the fact that English is not my first language. Sometimes what sounds good and polite in my head gives a different idea to others, but most of the time, it's not intended. Anyway, I'm glad we agree that respect is important even when we have opinions that can be completely different. Best regards!

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  84. Preparing to get flayed here, but am I the only one who thinks that if there's a parallel to Colette that it's Sam? Sam's the only one who has repeatedly pulled Dean back from losing himself as a killer. Sam taught Dean to consider shades of gray, he's the only one who sees a nonviolent end, and he was the one who pushed Dean toward Lisa - opening Dean up to the possibility of different future. They keep each other human was the line once used.

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  85. English is not your first language? I would never have guessed that from how well you write. I can guarantee you that your English is far superior to my abilities (which are probably non-existent) in your native language.

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  86. Hey! Better watch out! There's only ONE right answer! ;-)

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  87. Oh, wow! Thank you! I appreciate it a lot. :) My native language is Spanish, but where I live, I'm an English teacher, so I try to write as well as possible and I'm always trying to learn new things for the sake of my students.

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  88. I haven't read everything here but i find it interesting that some of you are making Colette=Lisa paralels. Are we forgetting that at the end of S6 Dean had Cas wipe Lisa's memories of him??? Because if so, that's just kinda grasping at straws and not very good ones either. A more obvious choice would be Cas, even my mom said so and she doesn't ship anything, lol!

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  89. You just want characters to conform to your ship, despite that they been shown to be heterosexual many times on the show.

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  90. Well, Dean is a heterosexual.

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  91. That's the militant Destiel shippers for you, Dean and Cas just looking at each other means they are clearly in love, and the writers are queerbaiters and a homophobes for writing any scenes that involve Dean and Cas.

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  92. The Colette/Lisa comparison is pretty apt. It is three years old, but that was Dean's last romantic relationship.

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  93. Nope, fans are only responding to what are essentially internalized issues of how the creators see women. Which on a show about two brothers essentially puts them into the "less important" category. I mean it starts with the pilot and Mary becoming a plot point to push the dude heroes into a certain direction. It's also why many of them are killed or not explored further. Blaming fans for internalized sexism is just looking at one side of the coin, although this is very much a dynamic system of cause and effect. I'm not negating SPN fans don't hate female characters. They do. But that is a rather simplistic first view on something that is much bigger than any of us. TPTB see women in their stories not as people, which is why the exploration of their characters is lacking. This in turn causes fangirls to judge these characters based on their own internalized sexism. Because our society teaches us to hate ourselves. We are essentially absorbing the social rules of how to be and how not to be, and that's why fangirls come up with "too slutty", "too mary sue", "too outspoken" and so on and so on. We are desperately asking for strong female characters, but what the show and what we all have not laid down is simply that strength is not something defined by the male gaze of how well a woman performs for a man's approval. Holding guns doesn't make a woman badass. Strength is simply being a person. Being a woman. And that comes with all facets, which need time and consideration to be properly explored in a show like SPN. It would need countless of scenes with single shots of Tessa's or Jo's face showing their pain in the same way that is granted to characters like Dean. How you relate to a character has a lot to do with how much information you are given by TPTB about them. Just like they do with their male heroes. The fact that the SPN writers refuse to do that, to give them a longer presence (even for characters that fangirls respond positively to) is very telling. They don't know how to write women, because they don't see women as people equivalent to the male heroes. The femme characters only serve to drive the plot forward or to fulfill stereotypes. They don't give them all the facets that are necessary in order to be a proper reflection of women in the real world and therefore easier to relate and get invested in. They only give them the barest minimum and fans respond to that instantly, because they are taught to despise something that is "less than perfect" or "too perfect". Even the women writers don't know how to write women. Because they absorb subconsciously what they are taught to be in order to gain approval. Don't write women like this, write them like that etc. SPN writers just fall into the same trap. This is a good post that touches on several issues. http://aiffe.tumblr.com/post/43660300604/for-all-the-women-i-have-loved-who-were-dragged-through

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  94. The parallel between Dean and Cain isn't over. The analogy ends with Abaddon possessing Colette and putting her in danger. Cain tries to kill Abaddon and in the process kills Colette. I'm pretty sure that Supernatural will put Dean in a similar situation. Abaddon will put someone Dean *LOVES* in danger, who he *PRAYS* to, who knows *EVERYTHING* about Dean and still *FORGIVES* him and *LOVES* him unconditionally, and who as Cain says, "WATCHES OVER HIM." Only this time, Abaddon will not prevail. Dean will. And whomever Dean saves will be the person this entire analogy was about. Only time will tell if that person is that person Castiel, Sam or Lisa. Though one of the three is already looking pretty ridiculous when you lay out this entire analogy. ;-)

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  95. The show is about Sam and Dean, and any other characters are pretty much doomed, regardless of gender. The show has had plenty of strong/smart female characters, a lot for them were just one and done. And on the flip side, the show has also male characters that were thinly written and killed in an episode.


    But the main thing about SPN is, the show loves to kill its characters off. Hell, I've even seen and article that laid out the stats of death on the show, and it showed that on average male characters die more often, whether they are the victims or the monsters.

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  96. thegraceofserendipityJanuary 22, 2014 at 9:31 PM

    Robbie Thompson has also admitted that his authorial intent doesn't matter - a concept that can be argued extensively in it's own right. Regardless, ever the diplomat (and contractually bound), if Charlie/Gilda were meant as an ambiguous parallel he wouldn't be able to confirm it.

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  97. This isn't about statistics. This is about justification for deaths and torture framing. Numbers only reveal the barest minimum, but the reasoning behind it is much more important. Why is Castiel still alive and loved and Anna not? Why are Crowley and Lucifer adored by the fans, and Meg and Bela not? Why did Kripke make such condescending comments about his femme characters? And so on and so on.

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  98. LOL. It's totes about Lisa! ;-)

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  99. Exactly. Carver also said earlier this season that there was nothing distrusting about Ezekiel and that was essentially a lie. The writers are not here to spoil us to give up their entire grand plan via Twitter. lol

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  100. Jensen also said he'd removed similar moments/lines about Sam. Because Dean is simply not one to be that directly expressive. So the removal wasn't him saying the line was out of character in content, just simply in the way it was being delivered. Or more precisely WHEN it was being delivered. And interestingly enough, after that comment from Jensen, the next season to follow, THIS ONE, is all about exploring Dean and how he loves. What he said to Kevin, the opening to the season with the chorus "Who do you love?" it seems we may get our answer at the end of the season. One way or another. ;-)

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  101. Castiel just proved to be too popular a character, Crowley and Lucifer are liked pretty because of Mark Sheppard and Mark Pellegrino's performances.


    Meg has always been adored by the fandom, the reason she was killed of had a bit to do with Rachel Miner's health issues, out of respect for the time she put into the character, the show decided to kill Meg instead of replace her with another actress. Plus they gave the character a bit of redemption with her death.


    I personally loved Bela, but I understand why she had to go. Kripke even admits that they wrote her as too much of an antagonist that screwed over/nearly killed Sam and Dean too many times, and would have written her a lot differently if he could do it again.

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  102. Well, I'm sorry I don't see Dean and Cas having a conversation as meaning subtextually they want to bone.


    Look Dean clearly has love for Cas, but that love is more familial/brothers in arms sort of love, not romantic.

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  103. No, the spell was specifically meant to expel the angels from Heaven. Abel being a human soul, is up there in his little Matrix world.

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  104. It doesn't sound unreasonable, but it's just that Sam already has another role in the Cain/Abel story – that of Abel. The story as told in the episode was about three people – Cain, Abel, Collette – and to me it just seems elegant to fill those roles with the three main characters on the show. But all interpretations are valid, and Collette could certainly be seen as Sam as well. "We keep each other human" is one of my favorite lines from the show. There's a deep, deep truth to it. That's also an important reason why both brothers tend to backslide into various forms of self-destructiveness when they are unable to support each other, like now.

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  105. I wish both brothers will forgive each other for their mistakes, but we all know that will not happen at the moment. They need to get all their frustration out with each other, there will be a big blow up between the two on what's going on. Then eventually they will get back together and smooth things out between them, they always fight, blame, through harsh words at each other, then they will find a common ground and make up. I hate seeing the brothers in the situation they are in right now, but this has to happen so they can see what mistakes they made then fix them. In turned they will get back together as a team stronger then they were before. This is the first time I enjoyed reading the comments, cause no one is hating on Sam or Dean, the others I don't really get involved with cause of it.

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  106. Jody and the Ghostfacers are really the only recurring human characters left alive from the Kripke years. No one made it out of season six to become recurring, and then there's Garth and Charlie for seasons seven, eight and nine.

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  107. I don't understand the "lol gay effect" bit, because the few times the show has had gay characters on, they were treated with the utmost respect. Hell, the show even confirmed that Heaven didn't care about sexual orientation, by having the cupid match the bartender and customer in "Sacrifice."

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  108. Yep. he's straight as Slinky :)

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  109. Except that Collette isn't a part of the Cain and Abel story (unless my memory of the biblical story is really, really off). They're two different stories. If you look at this literally, as in these exact events are going to replay itself, then it has to be two different people. If you look as this metaphorically as representing different parts of Dean, there's more wiggle room. In the story in the episode, Abel was more of was an idea than a real character, and could represent the imaginary Sam in Dean's head who has been the source of his deep fear since John warned Dean he might have to kill his brother. Collette could represent the real Sam. A lot of people are grabbing onto the romantic nature of the Cain/Collette relationship as being the most significant part of this story. It's not. Collette is the influence who stopped Cain from becoming just a killer.

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  110. I don't understand how Collette paralells Lisa? Dean didn't leave the hunting life because of love for her, he went because Sam wanted him to try and lead a normal life and he didn't know what else to do. She was mostly just a matter of plot convenience, both for him and for the writers. (And I recall there was an interview where Jenson said Dean only loved the 'apple pie life' she and Ben represented but didn't really love HER like that. Cared about her, but 'love' is deeper than an emotionally repressed guy like him can pull off at that point.) She certainly didn't love or forgive him unconditionally either- in fact toward the end before she was mind wiped she was pretty freaked out and alienated by his behavior... and she didn't even KNOW about his time in Hell... The only thing Lisa and Colette have in common is being dark haired women really.

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  111. LilNerdyDudeWithWingsJanuary 22, 2014 at 10:25 PM

    After reading some discussions in the comments section, I'm curious whether the author maintains her/his opinion on Colette-Lisa parallel or thinks it might be Castiel. Did the author change her/his mind about it? Who is more likely to be referenced, Lisa or Castiel?

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  112. Darn it. I put a lot of effort into writing a comment, and it got eaten when I tried to post it. I'll see if I can recall the gist. (Note to self and everybody: backup your text before you post.)

    Robbie Thompson tweeted that he listened to Reflektor by Arcade Fire on repeat while writing this episode. Watch the video on YouTube – it has a man/monster whose skin is made of mirror pieces. It's all reflections and refractions. With all the narrative mirrors we've seen throughout this season, it seems clear that Cain is a mirror for Dean. Simply the fact that he's CAIN, the original Older Brother Story, makes the connection unavoidable. I've been waiting for something like this ever since Michael told Dean (in 5.13, which Robbie tweeted that he had rewatched for the writing of First Blood) that he and Sam are direct descendants from Cain and Abel. And the way SPN:s Cain/Abel story differs from the one in the Bible makes it all the more obvious.

    Cain/Dean sacrificed his own soul to save his brother, who was being seduced by Lucifer (maybe Abel, like Sam, was Lucifer's intended vessel). Cain/Dean descended into Hell, was trained there and himself did Hell's work for a while. Then he met Collette/Cas, who knew all of who he was (Cas remade Dean to bring him back to life) and everything he had done (Cas saw Dean torturing souls in Hell), but forgave him and loved him unconditionally anyway. The word "unconditionally" just sealed the deal for me that this was about Cas. Lisa always had a condition for her love, since she was a mother: if faced with a choice, she would choose Ben over Dean. Cas chose Dean over Heaven and his sisters and brothers. Also Cain/Dean prayed to Collette/Cas, who watched over him – words strongly associated with Cas and Dean.

    This is a crisis point, the brothers are separated, and they both reacted in the usual way by regressing to various self-destructive attitudes. But, in a beautiful reversal from season 4, Sam had an angel with him who talked him down from the brink, while Dean was with a demon doing its level best to push him over. And when Dean stepped off that cliff and took on the mark of Cain – ooooh, I haven't felt such ominous foreboding since Sam drank Ruby's blood. That mark of Cain, the reversal of the angel hand print Dean had in season 4, is the physical brand of all his self-perceived sins, wrongdoings and worthlessness. He will have to erase that mark from his skin, just as Sam had to cleanse himself of demon blood, to avoid sharing Cain's fate (or turning into John Winchester, whose shadow loomed darkly over him in this episode).

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  113. I'm sure you're right, but it would have been interesting had he been shucked out...

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  114. And in fact, the episode's first view of Dean is him hitting on the waitress...

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  115. Her not remembering him is not the same as him not remembering her, though.
    Not that that "resolution" to that particular plot line made any sense anyway.

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  116. You know, I have no problem with people interpreting things any way they want. I do have a problem with being attacked for expressing my opinion. And as soon as they start throwing terms like queerbaiter, homophone, heteronormative etc around, they immediately sidestep any real dialogue about the actual evidence of what happens on the show. Look at what happened to poor Adam Glass.

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  117. And that bit is already getting cries of no homo from the Tumblr crowd. People can ship what they want, they just need to understand the fiction part of fan fiction, and not insult the writers/crew for not acquiescing to how they want the characters to be..

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  118. Thank you! And in fact this point is just a tiny, tiny part of my review which has been blown ridiculously out of proportion!

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  119. Why does it have to be only ONE right answer?

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  120. As I have several publication on this issue, I don't think I need to be "schooled" further in your point of view - especially not more Tumblr gifs. Please explain Mary's transformation into a hunter and leader of her family? Also. I'm curious. If you don't watch the show, what made you come and read and comment on this review. You have perpetuated the completely ridiculous focus on one tiny aspect of my review. Why is that? You would appear to have an agenda. Perhaps you don't, but the evidence is that you clearly do.

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  121. I'm simply going to sit back and let you do the arguing for me! Well done. Have at it!

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  122. The clear parallel here and the actual point of the episode is Dean = Cain and Sam = Abel! All this discussion over Colette just baffles me - it was one tiny point of parallel - which didn't negate thinking it could have also applied to Cas in some way - though I don't buy that particularly...

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  123. Agreed! I wish I could say I've enjoyed reading these comments, but this discussion has been hurtful and pointless.

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  124. LilNerdyDudeWithWingsJanuary 22, 2014 at 11:02 PM

    I'd love to hear the author's answer, whichever is. I'd like to know if it changed. There were presented some good arguments in the comment section and is only natural people to discuss it.

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  125. I do maintain my opinion on the parallel - but as that was about 25 words in a 2000 word review, I don't see that is deserves this much attention. It's ridiculous. I don't discount that there may be some parallel to Cas as well but I don't see it as important to my review.

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  126. Frankly, I saw very few good arguments. What I saw were insulting comments directed at myself for not simply agreeing with them.

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  127. So much this. They want their opinion respected, yet spend most of their time calling anyone who doesn't agree homophobic, hetereonormative, etc or just stupid for not agreeing with them. In essence, at least half their argument is ad hominem attack and disrespect for the original author.

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  128. I agree. I think you can find parallels to whom ever you would like--Lisa, Cas, Sam for different reasons. I also think that "Colette

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  129. I'm aware of what happened with Guy Bee and Chad Kennedy on Twitter (which was deplorable), but what happened with Glass?

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  130. Are you talking about my discussion. Cause if it is then I'm sorry, was just stating my opinion. I love both Dean and Sam and it does hurt me when they are like this. I'm only going by what Jared and Jeremy have said in interviews.

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  131. What happened with Guy Bee? Adam tried to explain that Dean and Cas weren't in a relationship and were never likely to be, but people were free to interpret things as they wished. He then said that he would never disrespect his gay friends and colleagues. He was attacked for queerbaiting and othering gays.

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  132. OMG - so much YES to your comment. Thank you!

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  133. I'm pretty sure she's not talking about you but all the delightful folk who seem to think that civil discourse involves calling others or their opinions "absurd," "ridiculous," and so on, or using extended sarcasm. All excellent strategies to show how respectful, tolerant, and open you are, of course. :/

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  134. LilNerdyDudeWithWingsJanuary 22, 2014 at 11:22 PM

    I am sorry if there are insulting comments directed to you in this article, I haven't seen them but I didn't scroll all the way down. I can understand, however, that it can be unsettling for bisexual people, such as me, to see the lengths reviewers are unconsciously willing to go in order to find a romantic *female* interest suitable to parallel Colette. It makes me think that even if Colette was wearing a trench coat in that old photo people would still not see how it parallels Dean and Castiel. And although this is a result of an extremely heteronormative society, it still stings.

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  135. You could also say the song playing in the bar at the beginning "Just Another Night" by Ian Hunter could have some subtexual meaning for the episode/rest of the season.

    Just another night, hung down slow
    I don't like the hotel let me go
    Hells bells! give me a chance!
    This rock 'n' roller don't wanna dance
    Just another night
    Just another night
    Well, it's just another night on the other side of life

    I never felt so bad; where's my shades?
    It's gonna be a long one getting crazed
    A head spoutin' noodles said, "what do you plead? "
    I said "you ain't got to touch a man to make a man bleed"

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  136. No! Not at all! I very much enjoyed reading your comment and completely agree with you!

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  137. There are no lengths to go to anything, Dean is and always has been presented as a heterosexual, ergo romantic interests are going to be female.

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  138. I don't know why everyone is going off over a small detail of a much larger picture. Sam and Dean have been compared to Abel and Cain since Michael pointed out their bloodline. Colette's purpose was to give a reason for Cain to not have killed Abaddon. I personally think it is just something unique to Cain's story and provide him the back story he needed to flesh out his character as well as show why Abaddon is the last knight of hell. Just because Dean and Cain have certain personality similarities, doesn't mean that every detail of their lives has to be similar or paralleled. Dean isn't his doppleganger or something (yet with this show who knows?). The purpose for Cain bonding with Dean was to compare the brothers because like or not, this is the Winchesters' story we are watching. I'm going to get hate for this, but at the end of the day, this is mainly their story. This is one review with one view of one episode. Chances are, everyone is wrong anyways. It may not even be addressed at all.

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  139. I'm sorry I just don't see Dean looking at Cas as him wanting to make-up with the guy.

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  140. Guy Bee and Chad Kennedy pretty much said the same thing, that Destiel wasn't going to happen, and both were inundated with insulting tweets, so much so Kennedy temporarily cancelled his Twitter account.


    I was kinda wondering why Glass was getting hate from the Destiel shippers on Tumblr, I mean he's not a bad writer or anything. Reading that makes sense now.


    Also it seems a lot of people that ship Destiel think Jenny Klein is a super racist for having the Casa Erotica DVD's be Latin themed. Which of course makes sense.

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  141. Thank you Lisa I do enjoy reading your article, sometimes people can make it difficult can't they.

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  142. Yep. They sure can. I've decided that I'm simply not going to read any more of the comments this week.

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  143. OMG. Well, they had to hate on her for something, right? And it wouldn't look good to hate on her for being a woman, right? Ugh. This is what happens when a fandom develops too much entitlement.

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  144. Thanks and no she wasn't talking about me, she answered saying she enjoyed my comment. When people get that way I intend to avoid those.

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  145. And of course there was the whole thing about her having Dean have sex with a women, which probably didn't help. That scene is pretty controversial with a lot of people though, I saw as Dean being completely in character, and Suzie being the one to actually initiate the flirting. But that's a different discussion.


    And speaking the characters and sex, the Destiel shippers also apparently saw April coercing Castiel into survivor sex with a PB$J sandwich. It shows you how deep the obsession goes.

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  146. What I remember Jensen saying was that he was uncomfortable with Dean
    saying "I love you" to Castiel because he's never even said that to Sam
    yet on the show. Dean clearly has issues saying those words, look at how
    he reacted when Gadreel said that he knows he does the things he does
    for Sam out of love. If there are to be any "I love you's" coming out of Dean's mouth, they'll be said to Sam first, I can tell you that much.

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  147. Sorry to hear that hon, wish some would be a little more respectful. I'm not saying all are like that, but one or two can discourage you.

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  148. I'm so sorry that you're getting hate for this ridiculous issue. Dean and Cas are friends. Lisa makes a perfect parallel to colette. It was a great review. Please don't let them get to you

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  149. Yes, it mirrors Dean's feelings of hopelessness and stewing in his own guilt in that scene. He seems quite drunk and is eyeing the waitress – trying to down his sorrows in the old ways he's falling back on.

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  150. despite the fact that i personally do see colette as more of a parallel with cas- i don't really get why people are suddenly blaming you for having your own opinion? i guess you'll find confrontational people everywhere though. there are many more respectful ways to say you disagree with someone. apologies, i suppose, for those who were rude. not everything is an argument, i think, and even if it is you have to realize everyone sees things differently and even though one thing may be crystal clear to you doesn't mean someone else is just blatantly ignoring it to spite you. sometimes they truly just don't see it. ah well, that's just my two cents.

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  151. Cain doesn't die because he is the knight and this knife doesn't kill knight , not because the mark , i think Dean not will be can't killed

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  152. Cain doesn't die because he is the knight and this knife doesn't kill knight , not because the mark , i think Dean not will be can't killed

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  153. Thanks! It means a lot. So silly to have so much discussion over such a small part of the review.

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  154. Exactly! My comments on Colette were a very, very small point in my review. It was merely an illustration of another way in which Dean and Cain were similar. And I agree, Colette was primarily a plot device to explain why Cain had given up killing.

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  155. Thanks - and worth much more than 2 cents. Honestly, my point was simply to show another minor detail in which Dean and Cain were similar! So many other things to talk about with this episode!

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  156. But it is different with Crowley and Cas because people are dying and souls are being taken from purgatory for Cas to be successful. So far, it's bad, but at least there's only one person who has died in Dean's partnership with Crowley.

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  157. Your elitism about "publications" is of no substance, since you refuse to even argue my points coherently, but prefer to dismiss my arguments in favor of your implied "superior education". As for Mary being a leader. She's dead. End of story. You haven't even clicked the link, since there are no "tumblr gifs" and the person has explained that point quite well, and I prefer people from all backgrounds talking about issues directly rather than published books, because our educational system is flawed as such and entirely dependent upon classism. So nope. No substance at all. And I don't have an agenda. I have an opinion about a minor part of this review and I'm allowed to express that, thank you very much.

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  158. She show has treated none of us with respect and if I start to list all the times the show has literally expressed their subconscious disgust, I will probably not even be finished tomorrow.

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  159. I think that's Cas problem's, not Dean's. But Dean does not look at Cas in a "normal" way, too.

    I must agree with a tumblr user who wrote "If Cas had a female vessel, Dean would have hit that harder than the fist of an angry god like two seasons ago". (four seasons ago, by now)

    And "if Cas was in a female vessel, she’d likely have died by now because this shit is sexist as well as heterosexist":)

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  160. Well, since my favorite character is Castiel, when I saw the episode I immediately thought "Colette is Castiel OMFG they're gonna kill my baby". So, that's why those 25 words are very important to some of us. ;D

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  161. Well, I think that writers don't know the past 8 seasons like we do. (Someone has to explain me how the frack Abaddon is now so powerful. Wasn't she in a box, defeated by the Winchesters? They took down Lucifer, Eve, Lilith, Alaistair and now they're shitting their pants, making deals with demons, accepting questionable marks because of her? seriously?) So, the most probabile thing is: there's no right answer and there was no parallel at all. ;)

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  162. Can I ask your opinion about Dean? Do you think he is bi?

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  163. Sam-
    -Knows almost everything about Dean, certainly a lot more than any other character
    -Forgives Dean
    -Jody called them each others church this season
    -watches Dean's back
    The Cain and Abel storyline doesnt apply any more to Sam and Dean, its happened. Sam isnt likely to be the Abel of the storyline line again in the near future. If we're talkign about foreshadowing then it seems most likely based on current storylines that Sam will have to pull Dean back from the darkness he has now gained with all that has happened and with what could happen now he has the mark of Cain. We arent heading down the Dean has to kill Sam to save him root again so this makes the most sense with where the brothers are now and seem to be heading next.

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  164. I'm 99% positive Carver means for Sam to be Dean's Collete, its certainly seems to be where this seasons storylines are going. The Lisa thing was an interesting thought though, it made me stop and think more about what the writers are actually trying to achieve this season with the brothers and this seasons mythology.

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  165. there doesnt but storyline wise at the end of the season Sam will be Dean's Collette, the other theories and nice and make sense but they wont be the ones that are cannon.

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  166. I think Destiel shippers are simply fed up with heteronormative being force fed down their throat. If a Destiel shipper had been the one to write that article and drawn the very valid parallel here, and everyone had started protesting because 'lol, dude, no, that's gay' (when most of the time, destiel shippers actually do nuance in saying that a parallel CAN be platonic), would you call them ridiculous as well?

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  167. The best episode in a good long while. I love the new Cain stuff, and I really enjoyed watching Sam and Cas interact alone. Let's hope we don't have to wait another 5 years for that to happen again.

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  168. "In the actual show that plays on television". I could hug you! I wish more fans would spend more time paying attention to what was going on in the actual show than what they fantasize about on tumblr.

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  169. I think you're missing the part where it has been shown time and time again that Cas and Dean aren't gay. So yeah, Lisa makes more sense than Cas because Dean and Lisa actually had a romantic relationship that existed on the show that this article was discussing.

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