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POLL : What did you think of The Musketeers - Sleight of Hand?

26 Jan 2014

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65 comments:

  1. Sandi26 January 2014 at 22:23

    Good from me this week, I thought some of the earlier dialogue was a tad clunky, like they found it hard to get the exposition out right, esp noticeable in the prison scenes I thought. I would also have preferred an episode before this one where we see the four main characters bonding more, maybe a road trip/mission off together with very little of the other cast members in the episode so we really get a chance to know them all better before we moved on.


    Loved the use of explosions this week, the two main twists/sleights of hands played out well and D'Artagnan's fight with Vadim in the tunnels was very effective.

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  2. Ally26 January 2014 at 23:11

    If there's on ething you can say abput the series so far, it's that it's fun. I think I would have prefereda tad more character development in terms of seeing The Muskateers actually bonding, but it was still an enjoyable episode.

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  3. Jason27 January 2014 at 00:16

    Liked it.

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  4. Sandi27 January 2014 at 08:24

    I dunno, if they had had been away from Paris I think it would have been sold ok, it was a large city even back then after all, but yeah it could only have been after one episode I think.

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  5. swanpride27 January 2014 at 08:35

    Yeah, I was also disappointed that they more or less skipped the early days of their relationship. But I had a lot of fun. Still not sold on Mylady, though.

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  6. Juliet27 January 2014 at 09:40

    It was a very enjoyable episode for me. Lots of action and romance. Things I like. The thing that actually bothered me more was the official BBC One tumblr page. I know it sounds silly. But the official page was promoting the icky Milady/D'Artagnan "kiss thing" from the episode by posting a gif of it and praising it. Then, the official tumblr page also promoted Constance/Aramis as a pairing by answering a fan wondering on tumblr what their shipper name should be (only because of the slap scenes, really, people?) I really don't want for this show to turn into a teen show with pairing fan wars and triangles/quads. Thankfully, there seem to be a lot of Constance/D'Artagnan fans. So that makes me feel more relaxed. Also, I did enjoy the Aramis/Queen Anne moments. They do have chemistry. And I'm intrigued by them. I just don't honestly understand why the BBC One official tumblr is promoting unconventional pairings on their page. There was one gif of Constance/D'Artagnan, thankfully. So that's nice, at least. I just want them to stick with Constance/D'Artagnan instead of playing up other pairings and such.

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  7. Justyna Kubica27 January 2014 at 10:05

    Really enjoying the show so far. It's just generally fun and nice to watch!

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  8. Bailey27 January 2014 at 18:59

    I enjoyed it. :)


    1. As a few have mentioned, it might have been nice to have an episode before this one with the Musketeers actually mentoring d'Artagnan, teaching him a few things, and the four getting to know each other a bit better, but I'm not too worried about that.


    2. I'm kind of an idiot because I totally misread Aramis's reaction at the end of the first episode. When he was handed back his musket, I really thought he'd picked up on the fact that the Cardinal had done something much more nefarious with Adele than send her out of town, but of course Aramis likely has no reason to suspect the Cardinal of that level of evil, yet. Thus, with him maybe more on the side of feeling spurned, the glances between him and Queen Anne didn't seem out of place or feel as jarring as I was imagining them to be, though they might have if the attraction had gone beyond that at this point. I'll be curious about if/when/how Aramis does find out Adele is dead, and the Cardinal's role, etc. (And is the Cardinal holding any secret grudge against Aramis for this, or is he just focused on d'Artagnan?).


    3. I enjoyed Constance in the episode, enjoyed seeing Athos more in that leader/directive role, Porthos telling d'Artagnan how to duel, and d'Artagnan's escape and subsequent fight in the tunnel. Overall, fun use of muskets and gunpowder. And, finally, Aramis throwing himself on top of a bomb with (Athos? Porthos?) yelling at him. Nice. Very nice.

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  9. Bailey27 January 2014 at 19:00

    Do you mean sold as effectively with the audience? The other Musketeers? Constance?

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  10. Bailey27 January 2014 at 19:03

    Agree - Milady's casting remains the one I'm most dubious about. She worked for me better in this episode than the first one, but still just not quite... there. As I believe we get more with her and Athos next week (including flashbacks) that's going to be where they have to sell it the most. Might be tough.

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  11. swanpride27 January 2014 at 19:50

    I think though they needed at least one ep beforehand in order to explain why d'Artagnan would take the risk - did the captain of the Musketeers and him even meet beforehand?

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  12. Juliet27 January 2014 at 21:29

    I enjoyed the Queen Anne and Aramis scenes. Their scenes made sense to me as did their instant attraction towards each other. They are both really attractive young people. Why wouldn't they like each other? Especially in Queen Anne's eyes, Aramis is a hero who puts his life on the line. Nothing more appealing than that.

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  13. Sandi27 January 2014 at 21:33

    It does look like we'll get a lot more on her, and Athos, next week doesn't it, thankfully. It's just too difficult to get such a large cast across effectively I feel in such a short time, I really wish we had more background on why Queen Mary's eye has wandered to Aramis too. I mean, knowing her as a historical figure, and from the books, it's possible to make educated guesses, but in context of the story they are telling us there is very little to go on for those who don't have that kind of background knowledge.

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  14. Sandi27 January 2014 at 21:37

    One of the things that annoyed me about the way the BBC promoted Atlantis last year was the pushing of ships, especially ones with the most tenuous of links to it. It seems to be the way that many networks actively promote shows online these days, and being someone who doesn't get into shipping anyway, I find it very annoying and would never visit their tumblr page I'm afraid :(

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  15. Juliet27 January 2014 at 22:08

    Forgot to ask! Did you mean that BBC One promoted pairings with Jason and other ladies in Atlantis? Not only with Ariadne? I haven't watched the show. But I thought the main pairing was Jason/Ariadne according to promos. But you're saying that BBC One still promoted with Jason with other women, and perhaps Ariadne with other men? Anyway, just curious!!! Thanks!

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  16. Sandi27 January 2014 at 22:24

    Hmm, any pairing really, not just romantic ones, so bromances too like Jason & Pythagoras was a very popular one and Pythagoras and Hercules too.

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  17. Sandi27 January 2014 at 22:27

    I think that they go with what is popular, twitter was awash with the shipping stuff during Atlantis, so much so that I couldn't have it open while it was on as it really distracted me from the show. It's either something you're into or not I guess. I assume they test the waters with whatever combination is possible and see what is popular and roll with it *shrugs*

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  18. Patrick Maloney27 January 2014 at 22:47

    Great

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  19. Bailey27 January 2014 at 23:01

    Ah yes, I see. Agreed. With it being so early in the relationship, the powers-that-be were probably totally hoping the audience would take the situation at face value so that their fake-out would work for a moment, and, yeah, it would have stood less of a chance after a bonding episode. Totally get what you're saying.


    Watching it, I didn't guess that d'Artagnan was going to be undercover at all, but I did think The Musketeers probably had some back-up plan to get him out of whatever it was he'd gotten into. When the episode opened on this random duel, I was actually waiting for a "Six Hours Earlier" title card to show up and then for the show to rewind and tell us how we'd gotten to that point. Not that I hate that method of storytelling, but I'm kinda glad they didn't go in that direction either.

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  20. Bailey27 January 2014 at 23:05

    In my opinion, sometimes I also think they're just trying to get reactions and draw attention (sometimes especially by suggesting an unconventional pairing). And sometimes I feel it's a little trite, like they're playing into, or playing up, what they *believe* online fan culture to be made up of.

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  21. Sandi27 January 2014 at 23:35

    God yes, the more conversational the better it feels like sometimes with them....makes me feel so old, lol

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  22. Bailey27 January 2014 at 23:58

    On point 2 - I'm so glad it wasn't just me, lol. Leading up to the episode I was really having this cognitive dissonance about Aramis just jumping over the grief and anger, and apparently being just fine with what happened to Adele while moving onto another woman (let alone that woman being Queen Anne). Plus, when I read that he would be making eyes at another, it felt like the writers were totally forgetting this whole plot point/plot line that they'd set up in the first episode.


    We know from the books - and good grief, stop me if I become the person that keeps saying, "well, that's not how it is in the books," because I'm truly fine with the show doing their own interpretations - that said, lol, we know in the books that while Aramis is a lover, and can be a womanizer, he also does not love lightly, nor is he exactly shallow. There's the one part in the book where when he hasn't heard from his mistress for a time, he's so in despair he nearly goes off to take his vows until d'Artagnan stops him by telling him he's heard from her (or has a letter from her, or something.)



    Regarding Aramis and the bomb, I like to think it was a combination of 'save the royals' and 'don't care about his own life' just because it does hint at such a complex character. Plus, Athos (I think it was Athos, but maybe it was Porthos) was yelling, "Aramis, don't!" or "Aramis, No!" or something, which might have just been a gut reaction to not wanting to lose a friend, but could also be taken as a sign that he thought Aramis's actions were excessive or closer to the "don't care about his own life" side of things.


    Either way, I love the nuance, while forcing myself to admit I might be biased because I'm growing more enamored with Santiago Cabrera with each episode. :) Nevertheless, I think Aramis has always been a really contradictory and complex character.


    And wow, that was a way longer ramble than I intended. Oops. ;)

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  23. Jason28 January 2014 at 00:15

    True, though I mostly meant more in terms with the audience. At least that's what I think they were thinking: let's try to throw the audience for a little loop. Hopefully they'll explore the character brotherhood and give us more of that development in the next episode, though they've naturally skipped some of it already and implied some of it occurred offscreen, which is disappointing.

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  24. Jason28 January 2014 at 00:18

    I don't mind the 'six hours earlier' style of storytelling either, I just don't think it would really fit for this series, or maybe I just don't want to see them using a device like that this early on maybe.

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  25. Jason28 January 2014 at 00:21

    Good we get more Athos. They do have a lot of characters to juggle, but it'd be nice if they gave nuance to Porthos too. He doesn't seem to have an ongoing character thread yet. Be nice if he did.

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  26. Bailey28 January 2014 at 00:25

    Yeah, I think sometimes if they can just create controversy, and make people talk, even if it's negative, they call it good. Old indeed. Some days I feel ancient. ;)

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  27. Bailey28 January 2014 at 01:01

    I hear what you're saying, and I buy the attraction between them. He saved her, and he sees the token she gave him as his good luck or saving grace. Jumping off that though, they're also both complex, deep, intelligent characters. For me, for them to really sell this going forward, it has to go beyond skin-deep pretty, imo. It can't be just because they're both attractive.

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  28. Juliet28 January 2014 at 04:55

    So are you saying that if suddenly Constance/Porthos (for example) becomes a more popular couple on tumblr/twitter, then the writers will drop Constance/D'Artagnan completely even if storyline wise, it makes no sense? I don't think twitter/tumblr represents what the majority of viewers want. Online fanbase is technically only a tiny representation of total viewers (millions). I would hope the writers will stick to their storyline and stay true to their characters. As a huge fan of D'Artagnan/Constance, I guess now I have to hope that other fans will also love them? That's a bit distracting! I mean, I don't know if I have time to check out how other fans feel about D'Artagnan/Constance! Sometimes, I wish we didn't have twitter/tumblr. Back in the day of no internet, writers stuck to their ideas. Now, it's all fan pandering on every show.

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  29. Sandi28 January 2014 at 12:52

    No, I don't think they would ever do that in the show (or any show on the BBC if I'm honest), but in their online publicity they would certainly cater for any fans that liked a certain pairing.

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  30. Sandi28 January 2014 at 12:56

    He definitely feels like the one I know the least about, perhaps because he hasn't had much of a relationship outside of the core cast so far, apart from that opening gambling sketch with the red guard?

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  31. Sandi28 January 2014 at 13:08

    Aramis is certainly my favourite characters at present, though I admit I am perhaps finding it hard to separate the character and actor a little (team Merlin forever!), so like you say these nuances may be more obvious to us. Maybe the next episode will show us more of these kinds of details with Athos though, the promo does hint at more of his past. Like Jason has said further up the thread here, Porthos is the one that is the one that we seem to know the least about so far and I wonder if this is because we just haven't seen him interact with others as much as we have the other 3?

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  32. Sandi28 January 2014 at 17:53

    I agree it feels more sumptuous than, say, Atlantis did doesn't it, and more authentic too.


    OT: Saw Colin last week in Mojo finally, it was brilliant, really worth the long wait to go!

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  33. Nimueh12328 January 2014 at 18:29

    Totally agree. Mojo was brilliant. I saw it right at the beginning and would have loved to see it again in its later stages when the actors have developed in their roles. Alas - one should not be too greedy! :)

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  34. Sandi28 January 2014 at 19:00

    There's always his next project I guess, whatever that will be. And I definitely want to see Ben Whishaw on stage again too, he was just memorising as Baby :D

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  35. Nimueh12328 January 2014 at 19:10

    Ben was a total revelation. LOVED him. I had never really noticed him before....

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  36. Bailey28 January 2014 at 19:17

    Good points, and I know I'm doubly biased because Aramis has always been my favorite character in nearly any incarnation (especially in the books, even though Dumas tried so hard to convince me d'Artagnan was the one I should be paying attention to). Then along come rumors of this show and there I was waiting curiously(anxiously) to see who would be playing Aramis: Santiago Cabrera


    Done, and done - Yes, I believe I'll be watching that, thank you very much.


    I do like all the Musketeers in this version so far though. And I agree, Porthos is the one we still need to learn about, and I do hope they give him more of those interactions with others and/or give him more balance with his own story.

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  37. magil28 January 2014 at 19:43

    Just catching up with the show. So far, so good. :)

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  38. Sandi28 January 2014 at 19:55

    I'd seen his Richard II and Ariel before in film, but live he was just amazing, such a presence :D

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  39. Sandi28 January 2014 at 20:01

    I was kind of the same, D'Artagnan was always the secondary character for me after the Musketeers themselves in many ways...well, not secondary, but I think you know what I mean, they were always more interesting to me.


    I think Howard Charles has done a great job in making Porthos as entertaining as he has so far, it's so easy to go too far with this character and make him just the fat/funny. But he has definitely brought a deeper meaning to him than that, a more thoughtful side, I found his warning to Aramis about Anne and his connection to the gold coin in episode 1 nice set pieces for example. He does need more to him, agreed.

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  40. Juliet29 January 2014 at 06:26

    Writers usually fan pander in the US shows a LOT when it comes to actually changing storylines/pairings based on fan reaction. So I'm glad to know that the UK shows are different in that aspect. Honestly, shows make more sense when the writers know what they are doing and have storylines planned in advance. I'm excited to see what will happen with D'Artagnan/Constance next. I also want to learn more about Athos. I like the actor who plays him a lot.

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  41. Juliet29 January 2014 at 06:35

    Well, Aramis was having an affair with a married woman. So it's not out of character for him to fall for a woman (Queen Anne) even if it's dangerous. We also have to keep in mind his characteristics. He has no fear at all. As he told Porthos, he sees Queen Anne as a woman. NOT someone untouchable or out of reach. He lives his life to the fullest. He doesn't really care about the danger or that he could die. So while he is intelligent, I think he takes life "one day at a time." He lives for the present. So it's in his character to fall for Queen Anne. As for Queen Anne, we still don't know much about her at all. It doesn't seem like she loves her husband. And she doesn't seem happy, to me. So we shall wait to see more background on her in upcoming episodes. She is a woman who wants love, I'm assuming. That's human nature. Just because she is a queen, it doesn't turn off her feelings and emotions. She's a human being just like anyone else.

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  42. Sandi29 January 2014 at 12:31

    Yeap I have episode 3, but I have a pretty full plate at the moment and have to get a preview up for a show that airs on Friday first today. So I will try to get Musketeers watched and up tonight, but it may have to be tomorrow, sorry for the wait.

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  43. Juliet29 January 2014 at 22:09

    No worries! We all have busy lives! Of course, take your time! And thanks for all the info you already provide for us! :)

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  44. Sandi29 January 2014 at 22:39

    You're welcome. Just watched it, it's a real change in pace, *really* enjoyed it, just writing it up now. It will only be a short piece, but I will get in the comments and answer/tease as much as I can over the next few days too :)

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  45. Jason29 January 2014 at 23:35

    They've already finished filming for this season, haven't they?

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  46. Jason29 January 2014 at 23:40

    Betting we find out during the season there was a little more to it than just physical attraction with Adele too, since Porthos called Aramis out on whether he really loved her, or just wanted to take something from the Cardinal. So, apparently he's hated the Cardinal for awhile and there are layers up on layers of possible motivations there. Kinda like I like it.

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  47. Bailey29 January 2014 at 23:49

    Yeah, I'm kind of wondering how they're going to play that in this version. Are they going to leave it vague, like Aramis dislikes the Cardinal just because he thinks he's a hypocrite or power hungry? Or are they going to give/create more specifics to build up that side of the story? Just speculating, but also maybe hoping it comes back around during the season.

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  48. Sandi30 January 2014 at 00:01

    I think so, but I think post production is still ongoing.

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  49. magil30 January 2014 at 01:07

    Also was totally with you on point two, just fyi. I do hope Aramis finds out she's dead at some point during the season, if he really doesn't suspect already.

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  50. magil30 January 2014 at 01:16

    I've always felt that unless the producers of any version of the three musketeers are very careful, D'Artagnan can come across as the most Gary Stu of all Gary Stues. Thankfully, in this version that doesn't feel to be the case, and I'm enjoying D'Artagnan just as much as the rest of the characters, so far. Well, maybe Aramis just a little bit more actually. ;)

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  51. Juliet30 January 2014 at 05:25

    The actors finished filming in October. They posted pix of their wrap party on twitter. But yeah, who knows about the final editing/post production/technical aspect of it all.

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  52. Jason30 January 2014 at 07:40

    I feel like I should know this already so maybe my brain is shorting out, but what exactly is a Gary Stu?

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  53. Sandi30 January 2014 at 09:29

    Yay, another Aramis fan ;) I know what you mean about D'Artagnan, Luke Pasqualino (well all of them if I'm honest) seem to have been cast very well and brings through the essence of the character without being too pastiche.

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  54. Sandi30 January 2014 at 09:30

    It's the male version of Mary Sue, a bit of a wishy washy character.

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  55. Sandi30 January 2014 at 14:26

    I'm really surprised that the Cardinal hasn't acted on her saying who her lover was just before she died yet, he has a great deal of restraint there that he didn't seem to be able to show when it came to making sure she died as soon as possible! lol :( I'm guessing that this has to be a plot point that will return later on in the season, maybe it will lead to the Cardinal's death/exile so that Capaldi is then free to leave the show and go on to play the Doctor?

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  56. Bailey30 January 2014 at 18:31

    I'd be surprised and disappointed if that didn't come back around. It doesn't seem like the kind of thing the Cardinal would just forget about or let go (after all, he had Milady searching out who the musket belonged to, I would think that wouldn't have been just for nothing and now that Adele is dead he just doesn't care anymore.) But we could probably speculate until the cows come home. On to the next episode, I guess, which I'm very much looking forward to.

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  57. magil30 January 2014 at 19:07

    A character without true substance or dimension, yet everybody bows before their perfectly perfect perfection. Pretty much what Sandi said: wishy washy and a male version of a Mary Sue.

    For the record, lest I get harangued, I’m not saying D’Artagnan is a Gary Stu, I’m saying in some versions he can unfortunately be portrayed that way.

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  58. magil30 January 2014 at 19:11

    Me too!


    And good for Doctor Who, and Capaldi, but it does leave a gaping question for us Musketeer fans.

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  59. Jason30 January 2014 at 20:07

    Right. Of course. I think I’ve always heard it Marty Stu instead of Gary Stu and was just too tired to make the obvious connection. Thanks.

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  60. Jason30 January 2014 at 20:59

    I can see how that would be. The movie "The Musketeer" comes to mind. Though I know some liked it, it was pretty unbearable to me because of that.

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  61. Sandi30 January 2014 at 21:05

    Hmm, I dunno, he's good in the role but there hasn't really been anything particularly outstanding about him in this for me so far to be honest. As they are doing a based on rather than a straight adaptation I think they will be able to do a work around ok and get in someone else to play a similar character.

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  62. magil31 January 2014 at 02:24

    Yeah, that was... not the best D'Artagnan ever.

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  63. magil31 January 2014 at 02:26

    True enough. I just like the Cardinal as the classic foe. And, guiltily, I guess I like that he's kinda specifically Aramis's foe.

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  64. Sandi1 February 2014 at 14:21

    I guess that there is that. I am really looking forward to it all, finally, kicking off between the two of them!

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  65. Bailey8 April 2014 at 01:33

    I think we'll find out more about the character motivations and nuances as we progress in the season and the characters get fleshed out, but I wasn't arguing against the storyline, or arguing against Queen Anne and Aramis. I meant just exactly what I said - for me, personally, there needs to be more to it than just that they're both pretty people, or it does a disservice to the depth of the characters, and I'm hoping the show portrays/progresses the storyline believably.

    Quick side correction: Adele was not a married woman, she was the Cardinal’s mistress… not that I think her being married would have made a difference to Aramis. In pretty much any incarnation of the character, taking a mistress, married or otherwise, isn't really an issue for him.

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