Hey there all you wayward sons and daughters! Lilith and Dahne are back for their final discussion on the 8th season of Supernatural. Sorry for the delay, but technology can be a pain. Up for discussion this week is episode 8.23: Sacrifice. This podcast is a little long but c’mon cut Lilith some slack; this was Dahne’s last new school Supernatural podcast. The grades are shocking but the discussion was very interesting. Come on in and have a listen. We just want to thank all of the listeners for their support and feedback. It has been a blast and we hope you join us all summer long for our discussions on classic SPN.
Announcements:
Please note the email has changed: twp.podcast@gmail.com!
TWP Does Classic SPN is underway, so be on the lookout for new episodes on Spreaker.com, SpoilerTV.com and (coming very soon) iTunes.
Disclaimer - As always the opinions on this podcast are merely Lilith and/or Dahne's opinions. They do not reflect the fandom as a whole or SpoilerTV.
Podcast Break-Down (All times are estimated):
Intro & Small Talk
Discussion Points - 7:00
Nitpicks - 13:10
WTH - 19:30
Favorite Things - 27:30
Least Favorites - 42:45
Grade and Review - 54:45
Season Wrap Up - 59:45
Closing Remarks - 73:35
Podcast Links:
Website
E-mail: twp.podcast@gmail.com
Spreaker
Voice mail - 502-233-1351
Lilith Links:
Google+
Tumblr
Flickr
YouTube
Blog
My blog
My Twitter
SpoilerTV
dahne@spoilertv.com
Thanks to everyone for listening. I have had a blast doing this podcast. While I am excited to see the end of Supernatural season 8, I am sad to come to the end of doing SPN podcasts for new episodes. It has truly been a joy. I am however glad that there are so many previous seasons to discuss. Plus I can be positive about most of them. Woo hoo!
ReplyDeleteI'm going to miss you terribly. I'm not sure you will be watching live in S9, but I hope you will still comment on episodes occasionally. I'll definitely be listening to the previous season podcasts.
ReplyDeleteThanks for doing such a great job, not just in the podcasts, but polls, opinions, articles etc. Of all the contributors, your POV is closest to mine. I dread the writing in S9, but I think I'm sticking with it to the end. I'm not sure what my line in the sand is yet.
Thanks so much for the kind words. I have enjoyed getting to know the Supernatural SpoilerTV family here over the years and the hiatus breakers were just as fun for me. I will not be watching any of season 9 until next summer so I won't be commenting on it throughout the year but I will do a season review on my blog where I have finished watching the whole thing. Maybe season 9 will renew my love for SPN that summer and I will join back in for season 10.
ReplyDeleteI'm hoping it will! There was alot about S8 I loved, but I completely get why you aren't sticking around for S9. The problems are big ones. But I'll be watching for your ideas!
ReplyDeleteAgree with just about everything you both say.
ReplyDeleteThe episode was a boring mess.
It just posed far more questions than answers. It brought no closure on the season, reducing it to uselessness, and if it had been at least engaging it wouldn't have been so bad but most of the episodes are depressing, badly-witten and forgettable.
You mentioned Crowley and Dick Roman's contract. I loved that part in the season seven, but then i liked Roman. I just loved his creepy little smile.
In the scene between the brothers, although Dean said Sam was the most important thing to him, he didn't actually say that he trusted him or forgave him for his 'sins'. So there's still room next year for Dean to put some more blame on Sam and keep the brother rift going, unfortunately.
All the things I loved about season 8 ended up being null and void, except for the Men of Letters bunker. That to me was Jeremy Carver's single good, lasting contribution as a show runner so far. However, it does give him a starting place to do some great things in season 9 if his arrogance and lack of knowledge about the show doesn't get in his way. I truly hope season 9 proves worth it to long time fans. I think when fans have been with your show for 8 years, they deserve your very best effort. After some reflection about this season, I think they will do a lot better next time.
ReplyDeleteI tended to not be a big fan of Dick Roman, mostly because he didn't have a lot to do and I could do without the theme of big business is evil for most of the season. Actually it was mostly because of the juvenile Dick jokes. However, anytime Dick and Crowley were on screen together, it was magical. That contract scene was one of the best in season 7 and it still makes me laugh at these masters of evil quibbling over the fine print. A beautifully done scene.
ReplyDeleteGreat podcast! Will they continue next season even though you won't be watching?
ReplyDeleteI completely agree w/you guys about the angel stuff. For a while now, I've felt the angel/Cas stuff breaks up the momentum and pacing of the episode. Something exciting will be happening to Sam/Dean or even just interesting, and then it cuts to Cas/angels. I hate that. Now, I must admit that I largely hated it b/c I didn't find the angel plot at all interesting. It felt tacked on and rushed. Maybe if I were even the slightest bit interested in Castiel and/or the angels, the cuts wouldn't bother me, but I'm not. For me, Cas is a secondary character who has gotten lead billing, and it doesn't work for me.
I also agree about Cas being a gullible fool. The Cas of S4 seemed more capable of normal interactions w/humans than the Cas of S8. What happened? Why is Cas presented in such a bumbling, foolish way all the time?
I like the Abbadon/Sam/Crowley scenes and, of course, the Sam/Dean/Crowley scenes.
I thought the finale was the worst finale of Supernatural, but I did greatly enjoy the Sam/Dean scene. To me, that was the most redeeming scene of the episode. I liked it so much b/c we finally got some insight into Sam. We got to hear Sam's thoughts, which is very rare. The scene was very raw and emotional. Jared acted the crap out of it. Sam spoke from the heart, and I found everything he said to be very genuine and believable. I've always felt Sam cared a lot about how Dean sees him, and this scene only confirmed that in my mind. I didn't know it was to that extent though. And even though Sam has never expressed these thoughts - the thoughts, themselves, were just very believable to me. I agree that the actual set up to the moment wasn't well-planned or well-executed over the season, but I believed the scene and the words coming out of both brothers' mouths. It was just a really good "broment."
Lilith is continuing with the show so never fear the podcast will go on for season 9. However, it will probably have a rotating schedule of guest hosts the way that the Arrow podcast is run. As for me, all the angels and by extension Cas became uninteresting mid-season 4 so I resent when we cut away from a good moment to get more heaven exposition. The fact that Misha Collins is getting the same billing as Jensen and Jared next season is yet another reason why I am not watching season 9. I can't stand that much angel junk.
ReplyDeleteFor me Abaddon was the highlight of this episode. She brought pretty much the ONLY action we had and it was a season finale. I agree that the ending "broment" had phenomenal acting. They always do. It just fell flat all the way around for me after the season long trashing of the brothers.
I can understand that. I just love my broments when I can get them :-)
ReplyDeleteI actually really like Misha Collins. He seems like a hoot, and I don't mind Cas. That said, I also feel Castiel has outlived his purpose. He should not get top billing w/Sam and Dean. I'm not looking forward to S9 either. I fear it will be far too much angel focus for my taste. At this point, I just want to see how the Winchester story ends. I wish Kripke would return or consult for the last season.
I very much like Misha Collins too. I just can't stand all angels, including Cas, or any part of angel/heaven story lines. My hope is that Misha Collins gets a starring role in a comedy somewhere. I think he would be perfect for it.
ReplyDeleteIs Collins actually getting equal billing to Jared and Jensen?
ReplyDeleteIs he now going to be considered an a full lead like them?
If so, that's so disenheartening. I want to seee the brothers not Castiel. :(
I hope not because frankly it has become grating. After the end of season 5 and what Sam went through in the cage I thought all this Sam is a selfish brother/bad brother was gone. And the idea he is the only one who has messed up or hurt his brother has become ugly to watch. I loved that we got Sam's pov and the heartbreaking idea he has been beating himself up over every perceived way he has let Dean down and not feeling pure since a child confirmed what I have always felt about Sam that he has been the more damaged of the two but we just never really got to see it in the same way we saw Dean's damage and issues.The one desire I have for next season is a move away from telling the audience and in turn the anti-Sam brigade that he is the sole one to blame or be in the wrong that there is proper insight into Sam that is done sympathetically and no more out of the blue inexplicable sl's like not looking for Dean that was just more fodder for the Sam hate machine.
ReplyDeleteI agree. Sam has been put through the grinder enough, but I'm afraid the temptation for the writers to keep the brother drama going is still strong.
ReplyDeleteThey seem to love that, and I'm afraid that the scene at the end of Sacrifice won't stop them from continuing down that road.
As far as the demon blood is crncerned. It's a part of Sam and has been since he was six months old. We don't know if Sam would have been different if he hadn't been infected with it.
I don't see what difference it would make for him to lose it now.
X
In season seven, Sam said he didn't feel guilty any more because he felt that the time he had served in hell sort of freed him from past 'sins':-
XX [ SAM:- I think I just don't... feel guilty anymore.
Look, I don't know what to tell you, Dean. I mean, I've spent a lot of time feeling pretty crappy – like, my whole life.
Look, I'm not saying it's logical. I just... you know, I feel like I did
a lot of stuff I should have felt bad for, and then I paid a lot of
dues and came out the other side, you know?
You know? Sometimes I see Lucifer when I friggin' brush my teeth, but, I
don't know, I guess I just finally feel like... my past is my past, and
I can move on with my life. You know, hopefully.
I don't want to sound lame, but... I kind of feel good, Dean.*] XX
X
I don't want to go back and list all the past moments but I don't put any blame on Sam's shoulders for what happened in the past.
He had been used as a pawn from even before he was born, and through it all he had never tried to physically hurt his brothe,r even when he was at the height of his blood addiction.
He shouldn't have trusted Ruby, sure, but he thought he was doing it for a reason, and then we have to consider all that happened from when Dean was dragged to hell.
All in all, Sam had crap to deal with and he dealt with it as well as he could.
X
Dean too has made his mistakes, but I don't blame him either, as his life was as difficult as Sam's.
X
X
Sam not looking for Dean cancells the whole of season eight for me.Everything that happens from ther on is false and illogical.
They should have given us a reason and they didn't. It wasn't a little thing but a great gaping hole that Carver couldn't be bothered to fix.
I agree that brother rift is not necessarily gone. In fact since the writers have shown in two seasons now that they can create a brother rift out of thin air, they could forget all of season 8 and still make brother rift the theme of season 9. I do however disagree that Sam has never physically harmed Dean. After all, he practically choked Dean to death at the height of his blood addiction. Both brothers have physically harmed each other plenty of times. I also disagree that Sam shouldered no blame in the Apocalypse. As a matter of fact, I think to erase that blame negates the best part of season 5. Season 5 is all about Sam on the path of redemption and it is at its strongest when we Sam actively working to repair that damage. Season 5 was necessary to get Sam back to a pre-demon blood state both in his own head and in the audience's head. It was by far the strongest, most cohesive character arc this show has ever had. As for the demon blood, quite frankly if the trials did not completely purify Sam of it then there was no purpose at all for this season. I hope that at least we are done with all the tainted blood junk.
ReplyDelete