Neverland is a mysterious island filled with mysterious people who kidnap boys for mysterious reasons. The whole thing seems like a callback to another show you two used to work on.
HOROWITZ: Uh, I don’t know what you’re referring to.
KITSIS: It’s funny — I didn’t think of that.
HOROWITZ: We honestly hadn’t thought of that, really, until you brought it up.
KITSIS: Peter Pan is my favorite. I love the idea that all the Lost Boys were orphans, and that they wanted Wendy to be their mom. In episode 21, Wendy painted this great portrait of what Neverland is, but of course –
– it’s actually kind of bleak and sad.
KITSIS: Things are fun for a day, but you need your family. You need an anchor in your life. And so I think we’re seeing that Neverland is a very seductive place for children. But now that you say that, the subtext…
HOROWITZ: You can take the writers out of Lost.
KITSIS: But you can’t take the Lost out of the writers.
HOROWITZ: But we can promise you, no smoke monster in Neverland.
We’re not going to find Tinker Bell at the bottom of a hatch?
KITSIS: No, but Ben Linus might be there.
He’s kind of like a fairy tale villain.
KITSIS: He is! He’s the man behind the curtain.
HOROWITZ: Don’t forget, Ben Linus started as Henry Gale from Wizard of Oz.
KITSIS: We’re really not bringing in Benjamin Linus, because he has a very successful TV show [CBS's Person of Interest, starring ex-Lostie Michael Emerson]. Before people get excited — it’s a joke!
So now we’ve got the Neverland stuff, we’ve got Bae and Mulan in Fairy Land, we’ve still got Storybrooke — how do you plan to cross between worlds next season? Will episodes still include flashbacks?
HOROWITZ: At the end of season 2, we’ve placed our core group in a very difficult situation. Some of them are on the boat; some of them are behind in Storybrooke; some of them are in another land. So the question is, how do we best continue telling their stories? Sometimes that will require flashbacks; sometimes it won’t. We want to continue to expand the storytelling modality of the show, like we did in season 2, where we were able to do things like flash back to Emma for the first time, or see time during the curse.
KITSIS: We are not going to be doing episodes next season that have five different worlds in them. We definitely plan not to overly confuse or complicate the show. It’s about simplifying.
So after Regina’s selfless move in the finale, do you think she’s been redeemed, or at least gotten closer to redemption?
KITSIS: The metaphor we used in the [writers’] room was, she was an alcoholic and magic was her bottle. One of my favorite moments of the year is when she looks at Emma in the finale and says, “Everyone thinks I’m the evil queen. Let me die as Regina.” In that moment, that was her arc of the season. Now that they took Henry, now that she’s on this ship, the game has changed, because the goal is not self-betterment — the goal is to save her son.
And Rumpel is also fighting to save Henry, despite that prophecy saying Henry will be his undoing.
KITSIS: Rumpelstiltskin’s whole life, he’s always chosen power over love. He even did it in the finale — he tried to kill Henry in the opening. And then when he sees that boat coming, he knows what he has to do. He knows this is a one-way trip, but he knows it’s the only way to lighten his heart.
Source: Full Interview @ EW
HOROWITZ: Uh, I don’t know what you’re referring to.
KITSIS: It’s funny — I didn’t think of that.
HOROWITZ: We honestly hadn’t thought of that, really, until you brought it up.
KITSIS: Peter Pan is my favorite. I love the idea that all the Lost Boys were orphans, and that they wanted Wendy to be their mom. In episode 21, Wendy painted this great portrait of what Neverland is, but of course –
– it’s actually kind of bleak and sad.
KITSIS: Things are fun for a day, but you need your family. You need an anchor in your life. And so I think we’re seeing that Neverland is a very seductive place for children. But now that you say that, the subtext…
HOROWITZ: You can take the writers out of Lost.
KITSIS: But you can’t take the Lost out of the writers.
HOROWITZ: But we can promise you, no smoke monster in Neverland.
We’re not going to find Tinker Bell at the bottom of a hatch?
KITSIS: No, but Ben Linus might be there.
He’s kind of like a fairy tale villain.
KITSIS: He is! He’s the man behind the curtain.
HOROWITZ: Don’t forget, Ben Linus started as Henry Gale from Wizard of Oz.
KITSIS: We’re really not bringing in Benjamin Linus, because he has a very successful TV show [CBS's Person of Interest, starring ex-Lostie Michael Emerson]. Before people get excited — it’s a joke!
So now we’ve got the Neverland stuff, we’ve got Bae and Mulan in Fairy Land, we’ve still got Storybrooke — how do you plan to cross between worlds next season? Will episodes still include flashbacks?
HOROWITZ: At the end of season 2, we’ve placed our core group in a very difficult situation. Some of them are on the boat; some of them are behind in Storybrooke; some of them are in another land. So the question is, how do we best continue telling their stories? Sometimes that will require flashbacks; sometimes it won’t. We want to continue to expand the storytelling modality of the show, like we did in season 2, where we were able to do things like flash back to Emma for the first time, or see time during the curse.
KITSIS: We are not going to be doing episodes next season that have five different worlds in them. We definitely plan not to overly confuse or complicate the show. It’s about simplifying.
So after Regina’s selfless move in the finale, do you think she’s been redeemed, or at least gotten closer to redemption?
KITSIS: The metaphor we used in the [writers’] room was, she was an alcoholic and magic was her bottle. One of my favorite moments of the year is when she looks at Emma in the finale and says, “Everyone thinks I’m the evil queen. Let me die as Regina.” In that moment, that was her arc of the season. Now that they took Henry, now that she’s on this ship, the game has changed, because the goal is not self-betterment — the goal is to save her son.
And Rumpel is also fighting to save Henry, despite that prophecy saying Henry will be his undoing.
KITSIS: Rumpelstiltskin’s whole life, he’s always chosen power over love. He even did it in the finale — he tried to kill Henry in the opening. And then when he sees that boat coming, he knows what he has to do. He knows this is a one-way trip, but he knows it’s the only way to lighten his heart.
Source: Full Interview @ EW
I can't help rolling my eyes at some of their explanations. Especially this one is ridiculous: "she was an alcoholic and magic was her bottle". Huh?? O.o You can say that about Rumple, but with Regina this season it's clearly been more of a question of 'love is her drug'.
ReplyDeleteAnyway, it sure sounds to me like the cast understands their characters and motivations better than the writers do, lol.
Imo, the problem is that they focus mainly on plot and methods of storytelling, instead of on exploring the core characters on a deeper level.
ReplyDeleteI have to hand it to them, Eddy and Adam are masters of using parallels and thinking up exciting scenarios, that has been the key to their success so far. However, the realistic, human drama, the psychological repercussions of events - that just isn't their strong suit. Thankfully, the cast is so immensely talented that they can bring to life complex characters, even when the script doesn't make sense on the page (but there are moments when even a powerful performance cannot compensate for the inherent lack of logic).
And I believe there are so many plotholes because the writers keep introducing more and more new ideas, abandon half of them along the way, and it's difficult to keep track of all the minor details that are woven into the story as a result. So they'd rather ignore character development or coherence for the sake of the plot, and they expect the viewer to go along with it.
Anyway, I didn't mean to be negative, but let's face it - OUAT is great with fantasy, just not as great on the drama front (due to the writers' weaknesses; the cast is flawless).
That was her arc of the season.
ReplyDeleteOh guys, next time try writing that instead of just saying that after you had 22 episodes to NOT portray it. Also, seriously, let's not with the magic as addiction thing because, while I know that Jane Espenson is derivative, it's BEEN DONE by the most popular and enduring genre show of the last 20 years. And it was stupid then.
About Lost/OUAT similarities: "We honestly hadn’t thought of that, really, until you brought it up."
ReplyDeleteThis is what makes me worried. They hand't thought of it, seriously? Just as they haven't seen Regina's story is copying Buffy, I suppose. Hopefully the break will make them realize some of these things and give them time to figure things out.
Having said that, I'm happy about how the Big Bad turned out, because there is a (small) chance it is not simply a "home office" trying to rid the world from magic.
I don't really believe them. They put SO many references to Lost in this show that it's really, really hard for me to believe that they didn't notice that Once is copying so many other shows.
ReplyDeleteI would be fine with seeing Storybrooke only occasionally next season. We shall see.
ReplyDeleteThey have not seen the SPECIFIC CASE of Neverland paralleling lost.I do not blame them. I first saw the parallels to death and grim reapers than I did to Lost(which was pointed out to me and only then it clicked)
ReplyDeleteWrong.
ReplyDeleteRegina is someone who suffered abuse as a child SHE WANTS LOVE, but just like Rumple she uses magic to dodge her issues and feel the power she never had against her abusers.
IMO, the problem is who they focus on, namely Regina, Regina, Rumple, Hook and Regina again. And because you know that Regina and Rumple will never turn good, much less die, everything goes round and round and round in endless circles.
ReplyDeleteThere's no balance left on the show. They found Snow interesting only in terms of her fight with Regina, and when she got a 'dark heart' doing something she should have done at the start of the season. Even Neal got to talk more about his feelings than Emma did, and Charming became a bit player. Every one of his lines was about the bad guys, about Regina or Cora or Rumple or Neal.
I still like Rumple because unlike Regina he's got some self-awareness but I'm pretty fed up with season 2's emphasis on the darkness of characters I'm now tired of.
Want to bet Regina will go back to the dark magic next season? They don't know what else to do with her, and Lana Parilla cries so pretty.
ReplyDeleteAnd my impression that these guys have NO IDEA what they're doing just got even more endorsed by this interview.... I think it's cute that they think they do, I do believe that they try to figure their show out, but they don't, they haven't and honestly, they seem quite incapable to actually figure it out. It's sad really...
ReplyDeleteI'm pretty sure they're joking. Too many references in the finale "we have work to do" being a huge one next to a shadow paralleling a smoke monster/MIB, we have 6 people on a boat near a mysterious-fate oriented-playing with time (prophecy-images of people not yet born) Island (oceanic 6) and I think the London Clock was set at 8:15 at one point. I'm pretty sure the parallels are going to be huge next season, except that the emphasis on childhood might be more prominent (as evil is made, not born)
ReplyDeleteMe too! I think to see a little less of it and to give us a bigger arc with Neverland would be a nice change.
ReplyDeleteYeah, but what I think might be the case is including references consciously without realizing the entire story might be a reproduction of Lost. I'm fine with references (even though I do think they exaggerate), but if this will be Lost II, I'm out of here. Not because Lost is bad, simply because I want to see OUaT, not Lost.
ReplyDeleteThey do that, half the fandom will hate them for it and half the fandom will hate her for it. It's the worst idea ever.
ReplyDeleteI don't think they're going to the same ending, I'm pretty sure they want to go "beyond" where Lost ended in some way, as they have gotten to these life extension and dealing with death sooner and more rabid than Lost did. I think it will always be similar, but yet there will always also be things that make it stand apart, such as the abilities of these people has potential to make their journey more dramatic, which is why I think this "Island spoof" will get us back to more soul-searching and less manic passing stories. I can accept and understant what they did objectively for this season, but not beyond it.
ReplyDeletePlease. Guys. Just give me paper and a pen. Because you're certainly lost. Lost. Ha-ha.
ReplyDeleteThat's because Regina and Rumple are the characters worth exploring.
ReplyDeleteWhat you're saying does not contradict my comment, so I don't see how it can be 'wrong'.
ReplyDeleteI agree that magic does give her "a kick", in so far as it can make her feel protected and somewhat more in control of her life. Yes, she loves using magic, just as she loves drinking apple cider, but I'd hardly call her 'an alcoholic' in either case.
There's a difference between using magic and being addicted to magic (just like there's a difference between enjoying a drink and being an alcoholic). We've seen her struggle to refrain from using magic in just one episode (2x02), and after that she gave no signs of withdrawal. In the long run, she has much less difficulty giving up magic than Rumple/Gold does (now THAT's a true addict).
To use a parallel with Lost, Charlie was often irrational and even physically ill when he needed his fix. There were times when he messed up relationships and missed opportunities because nothing seemed more important than getting a dose.
We've seen Rumple act this way with regard to magic, but not Regina. The only thing that she desperately needs and craves, is love.
It's so obvious that the creators don't understand their own show, I mean just look at all the plotholes.... I'm pretty sure they make the story up as they go along.
ReplyDelete