FLASHBACK TO DAMON’S LIFE IN 1970s NEW YORK / THE BAND DEAD SARA PERFORMS — Realizing that Elena (Nina Dobrev) needs some time away from Mystic Falls, Damon (Ian Somerhalder) takes her to New York City, where he lived and partied hard in the 1970s. When Rebekah (Claire Holt) also shows up in New York, she’s impressed with Elena’s secret agenda. Flashbacks reveal Damon’s hedonistic life in the underground club scene and a complicated encounter with Lexi (guest star Arielle Kebbel). Meanwhile, Caroline (Candice Accola) and Stefan (Paul Wesley) try to convince Klaus (Joseph Morgan) that it would be in his own best interest to help them track Silas down, and Bonnie (Kat Graham) struggles to keep her grasp on reality and do the right thing. Garreth Stover directed the episode written by Brian Young & Charlie Charbonneau (#417).
Source: CW
Source: CW
Alright. I'm beginning to think it's a little weird that Lexi keeps popping up around Damon.
ReplyDeleteWell I think Stefan said in season 1 that she was his friend too. But yeah, it is a little strange. Maybe Lexi just chilled with Damon when Stefan was not all ripper like. With the way she keeps coming back, it's a wonder why she was killed off so fast.
ReplyDelete"With the way she keeps coming back, it's a wonder why she was killed off so fast."
ReplyDeleteAgreed. I think there may be some regret in the writers room about that.
Additional thoughts:
ReplyDelete- If the title is a reference to the Patti Smith song (and the subsequent cover by 10,000 Maniacs) then someone is probably getting laid in this episode.
- What kind of ulterior motive could Elena possibly have that involves New York City?
- Why the hell would Rebekah randomly show up in NYC while Damon & Elena they're basically on vacation? No one likes a third wheel.
- I'll be very interested to see TVD's interpretation of the 1970's NYC underground club scene.
- Why is everyone off doing their own thing when Bonnie has lost her damn mind and wants to bring on the undead armageddon just to bring Jeremy back? Priorities, people.
Is this the one with Klaus having (finally) a sex scene?
ReplyDeleteno that will happen in the episode before this ..... 4x16
ReplyDeleteShe wasn't damon's friend at all because, he was the "bad brother" back then remember?, so no she was stefan;s bff, suppose "friends" don't kill said friend. rme
ReplyDeleteWhy NY? Wasn't he teasing her with tropical islands? Well, I can't wait to see Damon in the 70's. Elena with a secret agenda? I think I like the new Elena. But on the other side, she was already killing originals when she still had her humanity.
ReplyDeleteOkay, one stupid question: Why is Klaus still in MF? He stayed because of the cure, cause he needed support from the gang. The cure is gone now. Does he expect Katerina to show up at his door and give it to him? He should be out there looking for Katerina. It's another prove that JP wants to keep the originals in MF no matter what and that she has no sense for logic.
Maybe no one tries to reason with Bonnie cause she is too stupid and naïve to listen to the people she knows her whole life and rather lets a faceless ancient evil control and manipulate her. Just a suggestion.
ReplyDeleteI hope not. At least not with Caroline. Not now, not ever. After all he did to her I won't ever be able to forgive or forget her for that.
ReplyDeleteOn the other side, Klaus maybe would be in a better mood if he would get laid. Just don't let it be Caroline.
But Nadia is right. They teased Klaus in a sex scene for ep 18.
I guess Klaus' speech to hunt everyone down after Kol's death was just an empty threat ...shocker. It just makes no sense why he's on a bigger revenge mode against Tyler for turning his hybrids against him but is doing nothing to Elena or Bonnie
ReplyDeleteRight. I hate how they've used Caroline to dampen Klaus' thirst for revenge.
ReplyDelete"Why NY? Wasn't he teasing her with tropical islands?"
ReplyDeleteAfter how their last trip to an island went, he probably changed his mind. :)
"Okay, one stupid question: Why is Klaus still in MF?"
There are a handful of potential reasons, none of them particularly riveting from a story standpoint:
- Klaus is a pathetic, lonely douchebag and these people in Mystic Falls the closest thing he has to a social life.
- Now that Tyler is gone, Klaus is looking for any window of opportunity with Caroline no matter how small.
- Klaus is still around because he's more concerned about Silas than he lets on and the others have more info about the situation than he does at this point.
- Everyone he knows in Mystic Falls is miserable and he always seems happier when everyone else feels like garbage.
- If Stefan is right, Katherine stole the cure as a bargaining chip for her freedom which means Katherine will eventually come to him. So, all Klaus has to do is stay put.
I know but based on what Stefan said and based on the flashbacks we can see that Lexi and Damon were somewhat of "friends". She just didn't want Damon hanging with Stefan so he wouldn't become a ripper. I know he was the "bad" brother and he did kill her but before that he seemed to have this relationship with her in that he'd actually listen to her and he respected her opinion. Which is why he didn't go out to war with Stefan after she gave him a speech. I'm sure Damon regrets it to a degree, since he did all that planning so he could be with Katherine and she turned out to be a real pain in the ass.
ReplyDeleteYeah, the last trip was a disaster. But that was a mission. This would be vacation. Maybe it would be different. Although, remember S2, when Elena and Stefan took a "time off" and went to the lake? They were attacked by Elijah. So, maybe you're right and this time won't be any better. It probably won't, no matter if it's NY or a tropical island.
ReplyDeleteNo offence, but if Klaus has no social life, it's his own fault. He tortures and kills everyone in his way. His own family hates him, he has no friends, not even slaves anymore. If you ask me, he deserves it. On the other side, he was alone for a long time now, so that shouldn't be new.
If he wants Caroline, why not just compel her? It's what I ask myself since S3. And how naive is he, thinking he has a chance with her? He killed and tortured her friends for fun, he just threatened Ty (the person she supposed to love), he almost got her killed more than once or twice, … That is why I wonder how she can go to bed with him. I hope he compels her. Cause it would be the only thing I could understand and forgive her for.
You're right with points 4&5. The gang has information about Silas, and he enjoys it, if everyone is miserable, so he feels better (how pathetic. Did he never considered taking antidepressants?). But another lack of logic: If he want's information, he can get them the usual way (by threatening, killing and compelling. Like he knows any other ways) and doesn't need to stay. And if he fears Silas so much, shouldn't he, as soon as he finds out that Silas is not finished with Bonnie yet, leave and put as much miles between Silas and him as possible?
You think Klaus waits for Katerina? Well, she could offer the cure for her freedom. But she's not stupid enough to believe Klaus would keep his word. He never does. Unless he threatens. And besides, Katerina always seemed to know more than everybody else together, so she wouldn't have problems finding Klaus. Besides, she should know that she is on top of the most hated list in MF now (she defeated Klaus on this, something no one else ever achieved) and everyone wants to kill her, so she would be stupid to show up. She may be many things, but not stupid.
So, true, the gang are the only people he feels close to. Although he hates them. He can compel Caroline to do as he says, he always does. He can get information by force, as he always does. People suffer everywhere, so he can enjoy it in every other town. And Katerina can find him everywhere. So, I think, if JP would want him to leave she would make him leave. She wants him to stay, if he fits in or not, if he has reason or not (and if not, she makes them up).
Sorry my answer endet out so long.
To be fair, if Klaus wanted to he could kill every main character really really easily. It wouldn't be a good story to watch Klaus kill Stefan,Damon,Elena, and Bonnie for an episode or two. I mean, I agree he should be more pissed but they essentially had to make him chill out or everyone would be dead undead folks.
ReplyDeleteI think he doesn't compel her because he wants her to come to him on her own rather than just a simple compulsion that wouldn't mean anything. She might even be able to resist it like Stefan fought his compulsion. It isn't the same to mind control someone. If he just wanted sex from her then that's different. But he apparently has a soft spot for her. But I agree, her being with him is just weird. From a story perspective, it just seems really bad on Caroline's part. Although I think Joseph and Candice could pull off some interesting stuff as far as romance scenes. TVD aside of course.
ReplyDeleteAs for Silas, I don't think he even believes he exists like Kol did. Becca certainly didn't and thought is was just an old myth.
I agree on the Katherine thing. She'd need some sort of leverage. I mean he could just compel her to give him the cure or tell him where it is. Even with vervain in her system he could capture her and let it get out of her system. But she is going to do something big with it I'd hope.
Stefan also said Damon tortured him for 145 years but all these flashbacks in the 1900s say otherwise. But, yea I remember him saying something about Lexi and Damon being friends
ReplyDeletethat and Caroline probably said something to him, she is the only one he listens to.
ReplyDeleteI don't think its Klaus she bargained with. I mean even if she does hand the cure over with for her freedom, Klaus won't give it to her. He said that her death would last 500 years and I doubt even with the cure he is willing to lighten up. I think she is bargaining her freedom with Elijah. I mean, the guy has been anti social for a while. Its possible she found out about the cure, and weighed her options between Elijah and Klaus on who would be more willing to grant her her freedom and Elijah is more forgiving
ReplyDeleteI'm not sure I follow. I don't think Elijah gives enough of a damn about Katherine to waste his time on her. Plus, how would any bargain with Elijah stop Klaus from coming after Katherine? It's not like Elijah has enough influence over him to get him to quit his vendetta.
ReplyDeleteThere is more to torturing than physical. Damon was all the time trying to make Stefan drink the human stuff. Probably was a good bit of hyperbole to what Stefan said. Since the flashbacks do suggest there were periods they were alright around each other. Damon probably did make him miserable a good bit, or was the cause to something Stefan felt guilty about. At least that's what I'm guessing.
ReplyDeleteYeah, I get what you mean. Compelling her means, it's not real. But I have 2 problems with that. 1. Klaus always used threats, compulsion and manipulation (like lies and empty promises). He doesn't know it any other way. So, why now? Makes no sense to me. And why Caroline? If he would really care for her, he wouldn't keep on killing the people she loves, or trying to kill her (like when he bit her just to hurt Ty while the others were on the island). 2. After all he did to her, how can he think he has a chance with her? You know, without compulsion, a sire bond or maybe blackmailing. Or by changing his character, which he's not capable of. I mean serious. If a psycho would kill your friends just for fun, try to kill you several times just to deliver a massage, would you have sex with him (probably her. You are a guy right?) out of your free will? I wouldn't even stand being in the same room as this person, no matter how hot he is.
ReplyDeleteSoft spot? Well, if he kills everyone he has a soft spot for, no wonder he's alone.
Don't get me wrong. I wouldn't mind Klaus being with someone, even Caroline. If he could change. To tell you the truth, I hoped that he could change, that there is something good in him and Caroline could bring it out. Like Elena did with Damon. But every time in S3 I was disappointed. So, by S4 I gave up. There is nothing good inside Klaus.
Not sure what you mean. A myth? Well, it would explain why they haven't cast him till now. Cause they don't need him. But it makes no sense that it would be just a legend. The Five, the map, the cave, … He has to be real. Jer wasn't killed by a myth, but by a real person or vampire, or whatever he is.
Exactly. Katerina is not stupid. She knows she's as good as dead if anyone finds her. If she comes to MF, the gang will kill her the same second. If she goes to Klaus, he will compel her to take or destroy the cure. My guess? By now she's on a different continent.
You do have a point, that bargain with Elijah won't help her. Unless she gives the cure to
ReplyDeleteElijah, so he can give it to Klaus.
But I'm not sure about the "gives enough of a damn about Katherine". He was in love with her. Of course, that was 500 years ago, but still. He has a soft spot for Elena and he was in love with Tatia. Oh, another guy falling for this Petrova charm. Must be something in their bloddline.
She's too smart to go to Klaus. Even if she would want to bargain with him. I think, she
ReplyDeleteknows that he would give it to her, so he can use her for his hybrids. Or, he would torture her for a couple of decades.
Even if Elijah would be interested in the cure and she would give it to him, she would have no benefit of it. Bruce is right, he can't control Klaus. No one can. He also can't protect her form Klaus.
True, Elijah is more forgiving. But he has no control over Klaus.
Yeah, they shouldn't have changed Defan so much in the flashbacks. It all makes no sense when you link up to early S1.
ReplyDeleteYeah,but neither of those would be real. I mean besides if he changes. But that's still a lot to forgive for. And there would still be lots of mistrust. I mean, he's killed tons of people/hurt tons of people she cares about. Even if he suddenly has a change of heart I think she'd need awhile to forgive it. But yeah, I wouldn't get with someone like that either. lol.
ReplyDeleteWell, if you remember Damon had that whole problem being good thing. I mean he indiscriminately killed for a long time. Only in season 3 did he actually start being a nicer guy. With Klaus, he isn't around Caroline nearly as much as Damon was around Elena. I think with Silas walking around(kinda?) he might have a better chance with being good or at least forming some kind of temp alliance for sake of the entire world(himself included) and going with the good guys. But I don't want to see him become a good guy unless he is the one who gets the cure and we get werewolf Klaus or something. Mostly because Klaus is way too powerful as an original vampire.
No I mean Klaus doesn't believe Silas exists. Only Kol seemed to be worried about Silas rising. Klaus told Becca it was an irrational fear and Becca said it was a scary story. So neither of them believed Silas existed. Although Becca has changed her mind.
Well they say we will see more of her. So she better bring some protection. Like Elijah and a couple witches or something. That's the only way I could think of that she could walk up to Klaus or anyone else that knows what she did in MF and be fine. Save Matt.
Exactly! That is what I meant. She knows what he did. To her. To others. How can she forgive him? Or even trust him enough to go to bed with him? She's a total hypocrite. She's still pissed at Damon for what he did to her in S1 (not, that I defend him. What he did was wrong) and she's giving Elena a hard time because she loves him and sleeps with him. And at the same time she's sleeping with Klaus? That is what makes no sense. Sure people say, Elena is sleeping with Damon who also did horrible things, including breaking Jers neck, and she's fine with that. And I always have to remind them that Damon changed. He cares for the people he considers his friends, even if they don't like him so much. He risked his life for them several times and is helping them selflessly. And Klaus? He's still the same as he always was. I mean, it was ep 13 when he bit Caroline to kill her just to hurt Ty. And it was ep 14 when he threatened Ty, promising he would kill him. And in ep 18 Caroline is supposed to sleep with Klaus? Well, it only makes sense if she loses her memory or 5 years pass in which Klaus becomes a saint. But we already know that JP is not known for logic. And I can't believe she's ruining Carolines character just to get Klaus laid. I liked Caroline. She was great. Now …
ReplyDeleteDamon started changing in S1 and 2. He just often snapped. And he mostly did it to get closer to Elena (before he did something like breaking Jers neck to push her away again). As I said it. Elena brought out the good in him, encouraged him. And I hoped Caroline could do the same for Klaus. But I gave up that hope in S3.
Well, even if Klaus forms an alliance with the others to defeat Silas, it's not for the worlds sake, but for his. He probably fears his parents return. And probably the thousands of weres, vamps and witches he killed and who would like to have a peace of him.
No, I think Silas exists and Klaus knows that. He's just too stupid to fear him. Think. For 1000 years he was the most powerful and fearsome creature in the world. He's used that everybody fears him and he obviously believes, he can't be killed, that he is truly immortal. That is why he's not afraid of Silas. I think, he thought that the cure was a bigger threat to him than Silas.
You mean Katerina? Well, JP said, she won't be back as long as Klaus is in MF. So, maybe she comes back in S5. I already talked to others about her and they believe, she would make a good villain. At first I was wondering how, since she's a normal vampire (easy to kill). But she's cold, smart, and always has a plan and several backup plans. Besides, she's the best to go under your skin and inside your head. Maybe she will be the big bad in S5.
You don't 'let' someone 'control' and 'manipulate' you. To say otherwise is to downplay the severity of what your abuser is doing to you. And let's be honest here. Shane, or at least the thing now pretending to be Shane, i.e.Silas, is a creepy weirdo deliberately preying on Bonnie's sense of loss as well as her probable guilt at the thought that she was RIGHT THERE just before Jeremy bit it. Sorry, unfortunate word choice there. Just like yours.
ReplyDeleteNot exactly tactful, is it?
At any rate, if I was Bonnie, I would be a bit distrubed as well. Especially if I had witnessed a halluciation of one of my loved ones bleeding out and pleading for them to help me. Just sayin'.
If Bonnie would just use her brain and her sanity it maybe would not be so easy to manipulate her. Sense of loss? Oh, please. We all lost somebody we loved. Parents, grandparents, lovers, friends, children. But a sane person would not risk destroying the world to get this one person back. Elena lost far more than Bonnie and she's against that plan. But Bonnie still listens to Shane (or the illusion of Shane, what ever).
ReplyDeleteOf course Bonnie has a right to be disturbed. It's normal that she's down and hurt and feels loss. But it's no excuse that she still holds on to Shanes plan, knowing what it means. Releasing millions and millions of psycho vamps and weres on the humans she should protect from this creatures (cause didn't she always said that she will stop the Salvatores and Caroline, if they kill innocents? That it's her duty to protect innocent humans?).
Besides, this guy and his father in S2 (I forgot their names. Luke? Luka? Something like that. His father was dr.) manipulated her too. And they didn't have to control her thru illusions of her dead grandmother or dead lover. And also Shane manipulated her, before this Silas/cure thing got out of control. She was like a mindless zombie. She did what he told her to.
All the characters lost their loved ones. Bonnie lost her grams and her mom, Caroline her dad, Ty both parents, Matt lost Vicky, … And with "we" I meant every person in real life. I just tried to point out, that we know how the characters feel after losing someone. You probably lost someone too. And of course loss isn't measurable cause we all feel it different. If you lose a friend it's different than losing a brother or mother.
ReplyDeleteDon't get me wrong. I understand that Bonnie is just trying to help. But it doesn’t justify her actions. Returning millions of sups just to get Jer and her grams back? You watched Buffy? When Tara died, Will was so lost in her grief and pain, that she almost destroyed the world. And unlike Bonnie, Will didn't had control over herself.
True, Elena lost more people than Bonnie. But she was also closer to them than Bonnie. To her parents, to Jenna and Jeremy. Bonnie barely had contact to her grams (before it all started, she didn't even know she was a witch) and her mom left, when Bonnie was a little kid. That's what I meant. Not only Elena lost more people, she was closer to them. Just remember how close Elena and Jeremy were. And still, Elena was against the plan bringing them back, cause she used her brain and knew that they can't return every supernatural creature to this world. Cause it would be the innocent people who would pay the price for it. Bonnie is missing that part (the part, where millions of hungry vampires would kill innocent humans). She's too blinded by Shanes and Silas promises to realize it. That is what I criticize.
I commented (somewhere), that I understand why Elena burned the house. I would probably do the same. Could you live in a house, where everything (every picture, every chair and table, every vase and casket) reminds you on the people you loved and lost? I couldn't. Of course, I wouldn't burn down everything, but save some things. But still. I couldn't live on in that house.
No, no. You got me wrong. I understand and admire Bonnies wish to help her friends. What I criticize is, that she's naïve and believes that everybody likes to help and is selfless. She's not thinking it thru. For example, I said long ago that she was stupid to just blindly trust a stranger (Shane) who was teaching her a new kind of magic. She knew nothing about him, nor this new form of magic. And she didn't even took the time to get informations on this kind of magic. And she didn't even wonder, how come he knew so much about the Five. That he was able to help them with this (the curse). Something not even Klaus with his 1000 years could. Wouldn't you think it's suspicious? And still, she trusted him blindly. Even after she learned that he was responsible for 24 deaths. That is what I don't like about her. Someone shows up and says he could help her and she's all "I'll do as you say, I will never doubt or question you, I will not use my sense of logic". And I don't think being kind is a weakness. It just makes the person an easy prey.
Putting humans first? Bonnie? Then she wouldn't consider releasing millions of sups on humanity, would she?
Well, you're right about the hypnosis. We don't know what happened. But she's not completely under his control. Otherwise Shane (or the illusion, or whatever) wouldn't be needing the entire day to convince her to complete the ritual. He would just say "Do it" and she would.
Shit! Really? That is why I hate magic shows. Hypnosis is not a game. Well, if he programed her to listen to him, it's easy. Kill Shane.
You can't compare hypnosis to a cults brainwashing. Hypnosis happens on a subconscious level. Victims of hypnosis are mostly conditioned to do or say something, when they hear a keyword. They can't fight it, and they mostly don't even know they're doing it. At least that's how I understand it. Brainwashing means, that they fill up your brain with shit, until you believe it.